Date   

Re: Oil Separator

Jeff Barnes
 

I have an anti-splat, drains the oil-scum back into case, gunk into exhaust via a check valve which does the sucking on the case.  

Clean the check valve every 50 (oil change), sometimes less.  Get better performance from negative pressure in crank and never pushed the crank seal out since the install.  

Yeah, before the anti-splat on a cool summer afternoon the relief tube froze up and blew the seal out of the crank. Kinda messy.

I strongly recommend an anti-splat air-oil separator.

Regards;

Jeff Barnes
RV6 Race 411
N790DW


On Friday, June 18, 2021, 09:16:50 PM CDT, Marc J. Zeitlin <marc.j.zeitlin@...> wrote:


Greg Norman wrote:

I hear good and bad things about the oil seperator. Mike Bushe speaks against it.

Busch. I don't remember his being negative on the idea of an air/oil separator - do you have a link?

--
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Re: Oil Separator

cozygirrrl
 

A properly designed oil separator will do its job quite well but only if used properly. For one, if you only fly around the patch to stay current and to lubricate your engine then it is the worst thing you can add to your engine, it will do a great job of returning the oil , condensation, acids etc back to your engine. 
If on the other hand you fly long enough for the entire engine and oil to get up to temperature plus maybe an hour then the things that are not oil will become vapor and get separated and blown out while almost all the oil is returned to the sump. 
It works very well if you give it the opportunity to do its job. 


On Jun 18, 2021, at 10:43 PM, cozygirrrl via groups.io <cozygirrrl@...> wrote:

A clone of the oil miser we produced ten years ago. 


On Jun 18, 2021, at 9:16 PM, Marc J. Zeitlin <marc.j.zeitlin@...> wrote:


Greg Norman wrote:

I hear good and bad things about the oil seperator. Mike Bushe speaks against it.

Busch. I don't remember his being negative on the idea of an air/oil separator - do you have a link?

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Marc J. Zeitlin                      marc_zeitlin@...
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Copyright © 2021                     Burnside Aerospace


Re: Oil Separator

cozygirrrl
 

A clone of the oil miser we produced ten years ago. 


On Jun 18, 2021, at 9:16 PM, Marc J. Zeitlin <marc.j.zeitlin@...> wrote:


Greg Norman wrote:

I hear good and bad things about the oil seperator. Mike Bushe speaks against it.

Busch. I don't remember his being negative on the idea of an air/oil separator - do you have a link?

--
Marc J. Zeitlin                      marc_zeitlin@...
                                            http://www.cozybuilders.org/
Copyright © 2021                     Burnside Aerospace


Re: COZY: Re: [c-a] Oil Separator

Marc J. Zeitlin
 

DONALD BERLIN wrote:

Why we don't recommend air-oil separators...

Excellent - thanks for the pointer, Don.

So Mike's assumption is that if you use one, you're going to dump the effluent back into the sump, and he proposes that that's a bad idea. I won't (and can't) disagree, given that he has vast experience in this area, and I don't.

BUT, if you DON'T dump the effluent back into the sump - if you collect it, as Vance indicated, and as I do (and others) or if you put the residue into the exhaust pipe to be burned, then the argument for not using them is eliminated, and as long as you're willing to either empty the container on occasion (I empty mine at my CI, once/year with about 100 hours of operation/year), or de-coke the exhaust valve if you put the effluent into an exhaust pipe (and that needs to be done every 50 - 100 hours or so).

Thanks again for the pointer - after you posted it, I recalled having seen that in the past.

--
Marc J. Zeitlin                      marc_zeitlin@...
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Re: COZY: Re: [c-a] Oil Separator

DB
 




On Jun 18, 2021, at 7:31 PM, khalid Shuwayhat <khalid.shuwayhat@...> wrote:


Question,  since the oil separator is no return to sum. Does the mist of oil harm the propeller or moisture or cool it comparing to the hot exhaust gas temperatures around 1100 ??

Thank you. 
Khalid Shuwayhat 
cell 1-692 500 9333
cell witron 1-224 501 6026

On Fri, Jun 18, 2021, 19:16 Marc J. Zeitlin <marc_zeitlin@...> wrote:
Greg Norman wrote:

I hear good and bad things about the oil seperator. Mike Bushe speaks against it.

Busch. I don't remember his being negative on the idea of an air/oil separator - do you have a link?

--
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Re: Oil Separator

Marc J. Zeitlin
 

Greg Norman wrote:

I hear good and bad things about the oil seperator. Mike Bushe speaks against it.

Busch. I don't remember his being negative on the idea of an air/oil separator - do you have a link?

--
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Re: Oil Separator

Greg Norman
 

I hear good and bad things about the oil seperator. Mike Bushe speaks against it.


On Tue, Jun 15, 2021, 6:03 PM Keith Spreuer <kspreuer@...> wrote:
I think a big part of the oil mess on my prop is mist from the vent tube with no separator. I'd  like recommendations for a separator. One with no return to the sump.
Keith


Re: Oil Separator

berkut13
 

I put this unit on Thirteen and it works amazingly well.  

 

https://antisplataero.com/products/the-asa-oil-separator

 

They also have a pre-built oil return tube for easy connection back to the sump.   I have that installed, but I am not using that option just yet as I wanted to measure the amount of oil captured and just have it draining into a small Nalgene bottle.  It’s not much but it sure was a mess.  Now…nada from the breather tube.

 

https://antisplataero.com/products/oil-drain-back-line

 

Good mod.

 

-James

Berkut/Race 13

 

 

 

From: canard-aviators@canardzone.groups.io [mailto:canard-aviators@canardzone.groups.io] On Behalf Of Keith Spreuer
Sent: Tuesday, June 15, 2021 5:04 PM
To: Cozy Builders; Canard Aviators
Subject: [c-a] Oil Separator

 

I think a big part of the oil mess on my prop is mist from the vent tube with no separator. I'd  like recommendations for a separator. One with no return to the sump.

Keith


Re: Oil Separator

Bill Allen
 

Many years ago, in a Galaxy far, far away (Olde England) I fitted an ACS separator to my 0-320 LongEz, with a fitting on the accessory case to take the oil return.

The engine was a zero-timed unit, and I expected the oil consumption to be high until the rings bedded in etc etc.

But the engine continued to have higher oil consumption than I would have liked. Experts blamed it on changing from “straight” oil to AD oil too soon. Wasn't bad enough to cause major concern, but wasn’t what I was expecting.

One day, as I was replacing the LSE Hall effect unit which had gone faulty, I had cause to remove the separator which was mounted high on the firewall. As I disconnected it from the hose which drained it into the accessory case fitting, I noticed that the drain hose was full of oil.

It turned out that the location I had chosen was backfeeding up into the separator, which was the cause of my high oil consumption.  I blanked it, and fitted a catch bottle to the separator drain, and my oil consumption improved.

Just another “tales from Lake Wobegon hangar” FYI

Bill Allen
LE160 FD51

On Wed, 16 Jun 2021 at 00:12, skovbjerg <skovbjerg@...> wrote:
I am using this one


With return to the sump, but it is your call where to drain the oil to
:-)
Jay


On Jun 15, 2021, at 15:05, Keith Spreuer <kspreuer@...> wrote:


I think a big part of the oil mess on my prop is mist from the vent tube with no separator. I'd  like recommendations for a separator. One with no return to the sump.
Keith

--


Re: COZY: Oil Separator

Tim Andres
 

I had Blackstone labs do before and after tests on my oil with that specific question, if they saw any difference after the separator install, and they saw nothing to report. Hardly conclusive but FWIW. 
My thought on the gunk noted by catch can users is these type of installs are nothing less than a still. You are taking some of the blown-by gasses and condensing them in the cold plumbing and can. Because of the delta P between the crankcase and the ambient-vented can, lots of gasses flow thru the drain line in addition to separated oil. With the oil return system there is no delta P (between the separator and crankcase)  The same gasses and gunk you see distilled in the can have been blown overboard.
To each his own, I certainly understand how convincing the goo in the can is. I just don't believe that same condensate occurs on return systems.

Tim Andres

On Jun 15, 2021, at 10:35 PM, Paul Saccani <saccani@...> wrote:

I don’t think there is much chance of data supporting it.  Those who object to sump return are in the main concerned with the return of acids to the sump.  In principle, I suppose that acid vapours may be cooled and condense and be returned in some circumstances.  I think it unlikely to be a significant issue, given that aircraft engines usually spend long periods with the oil more than hot enough to evaporate acids from blow-by - at worst, it will take a little longer.

Crankcase ventilation in piston engined aircraft is generally, well, if not antiquated, certainly old fashioned.  A modern crankcase ventilation system, deliberately introducing filtered air into the crankcase and ventilating by a combined PCV valve/oil separator, returning the residue to the sump is vastly superior in reducing acid in the oil - even if vented into the induction system instead of directly overboard.  The PCV/Separator in suitable sizes can be obtained as a BMW spare part for their larger petrol engines.  Whistle slots and slits in case of icing still need consideration.

Cheers,
Paul Saccani

On 16 Jun 2021, at 08:22, Marc J. Zeitlin <marc_zeitlin@...> wrote:


vance atkinson wrote:

 Try the Cozy Girrls... they make a really nice one....

I have theirs as well - probably their beta unit :-).
 
I would NOT plumb it so the oil goes back into the sump.  That is some nasty stuff. Instead I took one of my wife's Revlon bottles and plumbed the return into it.

I do the same - I've got a collection bottle that I empty maybe once/year or so. However, I have a hard time believing that routing the stuff the unit collects back into the sump is a problem - it just came OUT of the sump, so it's already been in there. No? I just had no handy place to dump it back in, and I didn't feel like modifying the oil filler, or a return line, or the exhaust pipe - the collection bottle was just the easiest solution.

I'd be interested in seeing some objective data indicating that running the separator residue back into the sump is a bad idea, and why...

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Re: COZY: Oil Separator

Vance Atkinson
 



On 6/16/2021 12:24 AM, skovbjerg wrote:
Routing the oil return line into a collector bottle compromises the functional concept of the oil separator. The separator must have crank case pressure on the oil return line for it to be able to push water vapors with whatever acidic components they may hold out the vent line. Routing the return line to a collector bottle (without crank case pressure) allow some of the vapors to go into the bottle and make a mess of everything in the bottle.
:-)
Jay

 I'm talking about the DRAIN line not the large Vent line... In any case every once in a while I found this captured in the bottle... This is the only pic I took of it, and did not have it analyzed.

30% of the bottle is full.  And a third of that was white gunk.  I didn't see this every time I changed the oil at 25 hours, only occasionally would it show up.  But no matter, I didn't want it going back into the engine.

With this set up I had virtually NO oil or soot on the prop.  On long flights ( 4 or more hrs) I did get a very, very  ultra thin coating of something that looked like a rainbow where the exhaust impinged on the prop area.

 Oil is cheap compared  to engine parts so I didn't want acidic, and contaminated oil going back into the engine...
Vance Atkinson



Re: COZY: Oil Separator

skovbjerg
 

Routing the oil return line into a collector bottle compromises the functional concept of the oil separator. The separator must have crank case pressure on the oil return line for it to be able to push water vapors with whatever acidic components they may hold out the vent line. Routing the return line to a collector bottle (without crank case pressure) allow some of the vapors to go into the bottle and make a mess of everything in the bottle.
:-)
Jay

On Jun 15, 2021, at 17:20, Marc J. Zeitlin <marc.j.zeitlin@...> wrote:


vance atkinson wrote:

 Try the Cozy Girrls... they make a really nice one....

I have theirs as well - probably their beta unit :-).
 
I would NOT plumb it so the oil goes back into the sump.  That is some nasty stuff. Instead I took one of my wife's Revlon bottles and plumbed the return into it.

I do the same - I've got a collection bottle that I empty maybe once/year or so. However, I have a hard time believing that routing the stuff the unit collects back into the sump is a problem - it just came OUT of the sump, so it's already been in there. No? I just had no handy place to dump it back in, and I didn't feel like modifying the oil filler, or a return line, or the exhaust pipe - the collection bottle was just the easiest solution.

I'd be interested in seeing some objective data indicating that running the separator residue back into the sump is a bad idea, and why...

--
Marc J. Zeitlin                      marc_zeitlin@...
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Copyright © 2021                     Burnside Aerospace


Re: COZY: Oil Separator

saccani@y7mail.com
 

I don’t think there is much chance of data supporting it.  Those who object to sump return are in the main concerned with the return of acids to the sump.  In principle, I suppose that acid vapours may be cooled and condense and be returned in some circumstances.  I think it unlikely to be a significant issue, given that aircraft engines usually spend long periods with the oil more than hot enough to evaporate acids from blow-by - at worst, it will take a little longer.

Crankcase ventilation in piston engined aircraft is generally, well, if not antiquated, certainly old fashioned.  A modern crankcase ventilation system, deliberately introducing filtered air into the crankcase and ventilating by a combined PCV valve/oil separator, returning the residue to the sump is vastly superior in reducing acid in the oil - even if vented into the induction system instead of directly overboard.  The PCV/Separator in suitable sizes can be obtained as a BMW spare part for their larger petrol engines.  Whistle slots and slits in case of icing still need consideration.

Cheers,
Paul Saccani

On 16 Jun 2021, at 08:22, Marc J. Zeitlin <marc_zeitlin@...> wrote:


vance atkinson wrote:

 Try the Cozy Girrls... they make a really nice one....

I have theirs as well - probably their beta unit :-).
 
I would NOT plumb it so the oil goes back into the sump.  That is some nasty stuff. Instead I took one of my wife's Revlon bottles and plumbed the return into it.

I do the same - I've got a collection bottle that I empty maybe once/year or so. However, I have a hard time believing that routing the stuff the unit collects back into the sump is a problem - it just came OUT of the sump, so it's already been in there. No? I just had no handy place to dump it back in, and I didn't feel like modifying the oil filler, or a return line, or the exhaust pipe - the collection bottle was just the easiest solution.

I'd be interested in seeing some objective data indicating that running the separator residue back into the sump is a bad idea, and why...

--
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                                            http://www.cozybuilders.org/
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Re: COZY: Oil Separator

Marc J. Zeitlin
 

vance atkinson wrote:

 Try the Cozy Girrls... they make a really nice one....

I have theirs as well - probably their beta unit :-).
 
I would NOT plumb it so the oil goes back into the sump.  That is some nasty stuff. Instead I took one of my wife's Revlon bottles and plumbed the return into it.

I do the same - I've got a collection bottle that I empty maybe once/year or so. However, I have a hard time believing that routing the stuff the unit collects back into the sump is a problem - it just came OUT of the sump, so it's already been in there. No? I just had no handy place to dump it back in, and I didn't feel like modifying the oil filler, or a return line, or the exhaust pipe - the collection bottle was just the easiest solution.

I'd be interested in seeing some objective data indicating that running the separator residue back into the sump is a bad idea, and why...

--
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Re: COZY: Oil Separator

Vance Atkinson
 

 Try the Cozy Girrls... they make a really nice one.  Put one on my Cozy about 25 years ago...In the second picture.... I would NOT plumb it so the oil goes back into the sump.  That is some nasty stuff. Instead I took one of my wife's Revlon bottles and plumbed the return into it.

Vance Atkinson
Cozy N43CZ  2500 hrs TT













 

_._,_._,_


Re: COZY: Oil Separator

gary stull
 

I used Airflow systems separator. A little pricey, but you just install it in the breather line. It worked well for me. No return to the oil pan


On Jun 15, 2021, at 6:26 PM, Kevin R. Walsh <krwalsh@...> wrote:

I have this one:

With the exhaust entrainment vacuum port as well.  You need to service it every 50 hours to make sure it does not get coked up.  I drain mine back to the sump, but you are free to drain it to a catch bottle.  

On Tue, Jun 15, 2021 at 3:03 PM Keith Spreuer <kspreuer@...> wrote:
I think a big part of the oil mess on my prop is mist from the vent tube with no separator. I'd  like recommendations for a separator. One with no return to the sump.
Keith

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Re: COZY: Oil Separator

Kevin R. Walsh
 

I have this one:

With the exhaust entrainment vacuum port as well.  You need to service it every 50 hours to make sure it does not get coked up.  I drain mine back to the sump, but you are free to drain it to a catch bottle.  

On Tue, Jun 15, 2021 at 3:03 PM Keith Spreuer <kspreuer@...> wrote:
I think a big part of the oil mess on my prop is mist from the vent tube with no separator. I'd  like recommendations for a separator. One with no return to the sump.
Keith

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Re: Oil Separator

skovbjerg
 

I am using this one


With return to the sump, but it is your call where to drain the oil to
:-)
Jay


On Jun 15, 2021, at 15:05, Keith Spreuer <kspreuer@...> wrote:


I think a big part of the oil mess on my prop is mist from the vent tube with no separator. I'd  like recommendations for a separator. One with no return to the sump.
Keith


Oil Separator

Keith Spreuer
 

I think a big part of the oil mess on my prop is mist from the vent tube with no separator. I'd  like recommendations for a separator. One with no return to the sump.
Keith


Re: For Sale: Light Speed Plasma III Ignition w/Hall Effect Module

Andy Amendala
 

Sorry that was meant to be off-list.  Ryszard - Please reply direct.  Oops.

Thanks,
Andy

On Mon, Jun 14, 2021 at 11:51 AM Andy Amendala <ezwinglet@...> wrote:
Hi Ryszard -

I still have the ignition.  I'm currently outside the US with a cell service problem so I only have access to data.  I can E-mail, not sure how long this will take to get fixed.  I'll be back in the States in a couple weeks.

Any details you want to provide me on what you're thinking?

Thanks,
Andy

On Fri, Jun 11, 2021 at 4:58 AM Ryszard Zadow <ryszardzadow@...> wrote:
RAFE could use that for the Viggen....if you still have it plz give me a call 

8324285864
Ryszard 

On Jun 8, 2021, at 10:30 PM, Andy Amendala <ezwinglet@...> wrote:

Greetings -

I have a used Light Speed Plasma III Ignition with Hall Effect Module for sale in excellent and working condition.  Just removed from a flying Long-EZ.  Price: $1000 + Shipping.

Hall Effect Module has been inspected externally and internally.  No shaft wobble, smooth rotation, no leaks to internals, worked flawlessly.

Includes:
  • Plasma III Ignition Control Brain (Version B)
  • Hall Effect Module (600 Hobbs Hours)
  • Two ignition coils (600 Hobbs Hours)
  • One spare ignition coil (New - Zero time)
  • New Solder 15-Pin D-Sub Connector (Brain)
  • New Crimp 9-Pin D-Sub Connector (Hall Effect)
Does NOT Include:
  • Spark plug wires
  • Spark plug adapters
  • Hall Effect Module drive gear
Please drop a note off-list if interested or have questions.

Andy

881 - 900 of 110432