Date   

Rough River 2019

Nick U
 

Hi Everyone, 

Time to start planning for the 2019 Rough River fly-in is here on 26-27-28 Sept.  I hope everyone can make it. 

Lodging:
The inn and the cabins are all booked.   If you need to cancel your reservation the lodge policy requires you to cancel no less than 2 days prior to your arrival date or you will be charged for one night’s lodging.  

IF you decide to cancel your trip, please let the group know so you can designate your replacement.   In this case, the reservation holder can call the front desk to cancel and tell the desk who you wish to transfer the reservation to, then the new recipient must call the desk right away to pick up the canceled reservation.

Camping is available at the field.  Cost: $10 / night / tent.  Showers, bathroom are available at the field. Food is available at the lodge.

Local hotels are also available as well as Air BnB.

Food;
Food is available at the lodge in the restaurant.  Saturday, food will also be served at the field from a local food truck vendor.

Pool:
The pool will be open for those who wish to cool off in the heat of the afternoon.   Bring your bathing suits!

Schedule 
**Thursday Sept 26
Early arrivals.

**Friday Sept 27: 
7:30 pm   Time is available for a tent presentation.  Contact me if you're interested in presenting a topic.

**Saturday Sept 28:

***NEW***   
All Day Tent Sale and Trade
This year will be the start of a Tent Sale on Saturday.  If you have any items you wish to sell or give away (radios, parts, epoxy, hardware, etc), bring them with you OR if it’s a larger item (engines, propellers, wing cores, rolls of glass, etc)  take a picture, or make a sale list or do whatever works for you. 

We all have a left over parts and extras stuff collecting dust in the hangar which would be of benefit to other builders.   The tent sale would be a great opportunity to help builders acquire supplies at a discount.   I would suggest putting contact info on the items for sale to allow the seller and buyer to easily connect to each other since the seller will most likely be looking at planes.  

2 pm   Pool party for those interested.  BYOB
4:30 pm  General group meeting at the tent followed by an auction to support the expenses of the event.
7:30 pm   Time is available for a tent presentation.  Contact me if you're interested in presenting a topic otherwise a WW2 aviation movie (Dive Bomber) will be shown (BYOB).  

**Sunday Sept 29:
Departure

NOTES: 
1.   A projector and computer will be available for presentations.
2.   If you bring a dog, please keep them on a leash.
  
If you have any request, suggestions or inputs for the event plane please let me know.   

Looking forward to seeing everyone again this year.  Safe flying.


---------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Nick Ugolini, www.nickugolini.com  
Charleston, SC 

LongEZ N29TM (for sale)
Cozy 4, N826ER












Re: Bob tries to drink his way out of an an aft CG

S Remerez
 


Bob tries to drink his way out of an an aft CG

Bob Holliston
 

Touch and go at Hood River. 










--


Re: Electrical system design - Backbone, and Fuel/Ignition/Oil systems

KEN4ZZ
 

Have not had chance to closely think thru you systems yet, but one question does immediately come to mind:?? What program did you use to draw your schematics??? They are exceptionally clear and easy to follow.

Ken
On 8/18/2019 10:36 AM, Eric Del zoom2136@... [canard-aviators] wrote:

??

Hi guys,

??

I'm getting ready to re-wire my Cozy III.

??

So, before I dive in, I would like to run my design ideas by you guys to get your 2 cents worth. All comments are welcome!

??

FYI, this is a complete makeover as the plane was a hybrid 14V & 28V system fitted with steam gages and an old 28V Narco MK-12D nav/com and transponder. So, new instrument panel (full GRT Hxr avionics) with all new MGL V16, N16 nav/com, Avidyne IFD440 nav/com/gps, PS remote audio panel and others GRT peripheral to make it ADSB in/out compliant, new fuel injection and ignition system (EFII System 32),??2 batteries (ETX680),??2 new B&C alternators, a new B&C starter, a VPX-PRO, etc. Just so you know, all components are already purchased and sitting next to me, so if you suggest big changes, just keep in mind that they are going to come at a big price???Emoji

??

My system is based on Bob Nuckolls Z-14 design, but with a few modifications as I will be using a VPX-PRO as my main bus, well actually main 1 and main 2, as the VPX-PRO as 2 independent busses.

??

The 2 B&C LR-3C regulators will be adjusted so that when the crossfeed contactor is closed, only the main alternator will be online. As you will see, I???ve kept the auxiliary alternator out of the VPX control, so that if the VPX fails completely, it will not bring down both alternators. Also, all critical systems will have an alternate power path to the auxiliary bus.

??

I???ve also in these diagrams not shown a battery bus. I will be adding a small, breaker protected, battery bus for keep alive items (e.g. EFIS memory, the landing gear actuator, and interior lighting). All other component, including EFII components, are not going to be connected to the battery bus, as I don???t see the benefit of it, when I can connect to my 2nd battery via the crossfeed in the case of a main battery contactor failure. So, the only benefit I can see would be the reduced electrical load in the case of a dual alternator failure, but if this happens, I have about 1.5 hours of fuel (header tank capacity (see below)) to find a place to land, and my 2 batteries should last longer.

??

Also, you will note that my plane will have 2 solenoid operated normally closed fuel valve (1 for each wing tank). These will feed into a large header tank (approx. 15 USGAL) which as a manual shut of valve actuated from the front. For you guys who are wondering why put a header tank in the backseat, well my Cozy III is not allowed as a 3 place in Canada (because of weigh constraint), so I have no need for the 3rd seat... plus I needed a return line for the System 32 EFI anyway.

??

Finally, on the engine diagram, I added a few ???Bosch??? changeover relays to automate failover protection for the EFII System 32. These are usually in EFII???s Bus Manager, but I???m not using it, so I needed 1 for the injector module, and 1 for the ???injector enable??? function.??The injector enable function will also be controlled via a second changeover relay (???Injector Select Relay???). This is to link the injectors control to the ECU selected via the ???key switch???. Because, only one ECU can control the injectors at a time, when both ECU are selected, ECU 1 controls the injectors.


Looking forward to your comments.

??

Eric


PS. A few AMP rating are missing for circuit protection, I will update them when I have the info.


Re: Electrical system design - Backbone, and Fuel/Ignition/Oil systems

Jack Wilhelmson
 

Check the current capacity of your main battery contactor. If it is a standard 50 amp connector it will fail eventually because the starter current is 200 amps or more. This usually happens when the contactor drops out due to low battery voltage during starting. This is a old problem that has been ignored by all the "experts". There is a solution without creating a stuck starter problem.

Regards

Jack Wilhelmson

On Sun, Aug 18, 2019 at 11:37 AM Eric Del zoom2136@... [canard-aviators] <canard-aviators@...> wrote:
 

Hi guys,

 

I'm getting ready to re-wire my Cozy III.

 

So, before I dive in, I would like to run my design ideas by you guys to get your 2 cents worth. All comments are welcome!

 

FYI, this is a complete makeover as the plane was a hybrid 14V & 28V system fitted with steam gages and an old 28V Narco MK-12D nav/com and transponder. So, new instrument panel (full GRT Hxr avionics) with all new MGL V16, N16 nav/com, Avidyne IFD440 nav/com/gps, PS remote audio panel and others GRT peripheral to make it ADSB in/out compliant, new fuel injection and ignition system (EFII System 32), 2 batteries (ETX680), 2 new B&C alternators, a new B&C starter, a VPX-PRO, etc. Just so you know, all components are already purchased and sitting next to me, so if you suggest big changes, just keep in mind that they are going to come at a big price…Emoji

 

My system is based on Bob Nuckolls Z-14 design, but with a few modifications as I will be using a VPX-PRO as my main bus, well actually main 1 and main 2, as the VPX-PRO as 2 independent busses.

 

The 2 B&C LR-3C regulators will be adjusted so that when the crossfeed contactor is closed, only the main alternator will be online. As you will see, I’ve kept the auxiliary alternator out of the VPX control, so that if the VPX fails completely, it will not bring down both alternators. Also, all critical systems will have an alternate power path to the auxiliary bus.

 

I’ve also in these diagrams not shown a battery bus. I will be adding a small, breaker protected, battery bus for keep alive items (e.g. EFIS memory, the landing gear actuator, and interior lighting). All other component, including EFII components, are not going to be connected to the battery bus, as I don’t see the benefit of it, when I can connect to my 2nd battery via the crossfeed in the case of a main battery contactor failure. So, the only benefit I can see would be the reduced electrical load in the case of a dual alternator failure, but if this happens, I have about 1.5 hours of fuel (header tank capacity (see below)) to find a place to land, and my 2 batteries should last longer.

 

Also, you will note that my plane will have 2 solenoid operated normally closed fuel valve (1 for each wing tank). These will feed into a large header tank (approx. 15 USGAL) which as a manual shut of valve actuated from the front. For you guys who are wondering why put a header tank in the backseat, well my Cozy III is not allowed as a 3 place in Canada (because of weigh constraint), so I have no need for the 3rd seat... plus I needed a return line for the System 32 EFI anyway.

 

Finally, on the engine diagram, I added a few “Bosch” changeover relays to automate failover protection for the EFII System 32. These are usually in EFII’s Bus Manager, but I’m not using it, so I needed 1 for the injector module, and 1 for the “injector enable” function. The injector enable function will also be controlled via a second changeover relay (“Injector Select Relay”). This is to link the injectors control to the ECU selected via the “key switch”. Because, only one ECU can control the injectors at a time, when both ECU are selected, ECU 1 controls the injectors.


Looking forward to your comments.

 

Eric


PS. A few AMP rating are missing for circuit protection, I will update them when I have the info.


Electrical system design - Backbone, and Fuel/Ignition/Oil systems

Eric Del
 

Hi guys,

 

I'm getting ready to re-wire my Cozy III.

 

So, before I dive in, I would like to run my design ideas by you guys to get your 2 cents worth. All comments are welcome!

 

FYI, this is a complete makeover as the plane was a hybrid 14V & 28V system fitted with steam gages and an old 28V Narco MK-12D nav/com and transponder. So, new instrument panel (full GRT Hxr avionics) with all new MGL V16, N16 nav/com, Avidyne IFD440 nav/com/gps, PS remote audio panel and others GRT peripheral to make it ADSB in/out compliant, new fuel injection and ignition system (EFII System 32), 2 batteries (ETX680), 2 new B&C alternators, a new B&C starter, a VPX-PRO, etc. Just so you know, all components are already purchased and sitting next to me, so if you suggest big changes, just keep in mind that they are going to come at a big price…Emoji

 

My system is based on Bob Nuckolls Z-14 design, but with a few modifications as I will be using a VPX-PRO as my main bus, well actually main 1 and main 2, as the VPX-PRO as 2 independent busses.

 

The 2 B&C LR-3C regulators will be adjusted so that when the crossfeed contactor is closed, only the main alternator will be online. As you will see, I’ve kept the auxiliary alternator out of the VPX control, so that if the VPX fails completely, it will not bring down both alternators. Also, all critical systems will have an alternate power path to the auxiliary bus.

 

I’ve also in these diagrams not shown a battery bus. I will be adding a small, breaker protected, battery bus for keep alive items (e.g. EFIS memory, the landing gear actuator, and interior lighting). All other component, including EFII components, are not going to be connected to the battery bus, as I don’t see the benefit of it, when I can connect to my 2nd battery via the crossfeed in the case of a main battery contactor failure. So, the only benefit I can see would be the reduced electrical load in the case of a dual alternator failure, but if this happens, I have about 1.5 hours of fuel (header tank capacity (see below)) to find a place to land, and my 2 batteries should last longer.

 

Also, you will note that my plane will have 2 solenoid operated normally closed fuel valve (1 for each wing tank). These will feed into a large header tank (approx. 15 USGAL) which as a manual shut of valve actuated from the front. For you guys who are wondering why put a header tank in the backseat, well my Cozy III is not allowed as a 3 place in Canada (because of weigh constraint), so I have no need for the 3rd seat... plus I needed a return line for the System 32 EFI anyway.

 

Finally, on the engine diagram, I added a few “Bosch” changeover relays to automate failover protection for the EFII System 32. These are usually in EFII’s Bus Manager, but I’m not using it, so I needed 1 for the injector module, and 1 for the “injector enable” function. The injector enable function will also be controlled via a second changeover relay (“Injector Select Relay”). This is to link the injectors control to the ECU selected via the “key switch”. Because, only one ECU can control the injectors at a time, when both ECU are selected, ECU 1 controls the injectors.


Looking forward to your comments.

 

Eric


PS. A few AMP rating are missing for circuit protection, I will update them when I have the info.


Re: Was <In Cowl Flow Visualization > builders v flyers

Bob Holliston
 

Dave Lind, one of my hero's,  was in both groups. He built the most perfect LongEZ I've ever seen and flew the hell out of it too, in fact to ALL 50 states. He worked on it constantly and was unbeatable at the R.A.C.E. races in the superstock (320) class. At one of the races I noticed about one square inch of orange peel on one of his winglets and enjoyed showing it to him. He said "You didn't bring any 1500 grit sandpaper with you, did you?" LOL. 


On Sun, Aug 18, 2019 at 1:32 AM Bill Allen billallensworld@... [canard-aviators] <canard-aviators@...> wrote:
 

Burrall is right. I built my LE 34 years ago, and I’ve rebuilt it 3 times, - not from any accident damage, just because I found better ways to do things, engines, panels, fuel systems etc. I was born with a chrome-vanadium wrench in my mouth.
I have a LE with a Diesel engine in which I seem to continually find fresh things to improve, and a CZ4 which had a great steam panel which didn’t have  to be replaced by a Garmin G3X setup.
 If it wasn’t aircraft, it would be cars or boats - in fact it used to be cars/motorsport when I was younger, but what I disliked about motorsport was that you spent time and money getting the machine as good as you could, and then at the weekend when you raced it, either you, or someone else would likely wreck all or part of it, so it would all have to be done again. With an aircraft you aim to get it as close to perfect (there are no perfectly good aircraft) and keep it that way. 
I’ve visited Burrall a couple of times on my trans-USA EZ flights, and his place is a builder paradise!
As to the flying, I seem to fly more when I’m in the US because in the UK the weather is more unpredictable, landing fees high (typ$20) fuel costs c.$9gal and airspace congested. 

Bill Allen
CZ4 G-BYLZ
LE 160 N99BA
LeD G-LEZE
VE N2CR


On Sat, 17 Aug 2019 at 18:54, Burrall Sanders craftsman@... [canard-aviators] <canard-aviators@...> wrote:
 

Ryszard and all,

I put most builders into two groups,  one group BUILDS TO BUILD and loves to tinker and tend have nice looking planes when they are done but, far too many tinkerers never get the plane in the air.  The other group BUILDS TO FLY, they may enjoy the build but the only reason they are building is to fly it. Some of the worst workmanship we at Freeflight have observed has been on planes built by the second group.  And some of the most beautiful hanger queens were built by the first group.  No one should take any  of this personally because I am generalizing a bunch. Me?  Even though Freeflight has produced several Osh Kosh award winners I am in the second group, personally.   In setting out to build my Cozy IIIx I made some goals.  I wanted reliability and performance to be outstanding,  I also wanted a plane that looked good and new when it was but did not care about winning any awards. I did not set out for a show winner and did not get one, but I did get a plane with superb reliability and pretty darn good performance.  Won a few of the canard races at Kanab over the years.

Ryszard is absolutely right about all of them being individual aircraft and what works on one will not necessarily work on another.  That can be difficult to explain to a customer but it is a fact of life.

 

Best,

Burrall

 

 

 

Sent from Mail for Windows 10

 

From: B Smith bsmith51@... [canard-aviators]
Sent: Saturday, August 17, 2019 9:33 AM
To: canard-aviators@yahoogroups..com
Subject: Re: [c-a] In Cowl Flow Visualization

 

 

From my observation, given the daunting task of building a composite aircraft, the ones who complete are, from the start, builders.  Such people are natural tinkerers; it's a calling.  Flying is done not necessarily to go anywhere but to validate the last improvement.

 

On Sat, Aug 17, 2019 at 5:23 AM Ryszard Zadow ryszardzadow@att..net [canard-aviators] <canard-aviators@...> wrote:

 

I got a digital pressure gauge that read inches of water and ran 16 plastic tubes back into the cowlings. Each tube was numbered and I’d swap tubes and take readings.  I was able to “map” pressures around the engine. It confirmed some things that I thought I already knew and made me realize I was way off on others. 

 

One thing we’ve learned doing all this test flying at Jetguys is no two EZs are the same. What makes one cool well doesn’t often work on another. That reinforces how individual these airplanes are. Compare that to cookie-cutter kitplanes.  While attending the FFI formation clinic in Kansas City last spring I made an observation to fellow LongEZ driver Bob Stevens that was also flying there. 65 RVs were in that clinic. The entire weekend none of those guys talked about cooling. None of them bragged about how fast they were or talked about speed mods. They got in their airplanes and FLEW! Their airplanes always started. It was a stark contrast to the EZ community where we can’t get 65 EZs to show up at a fly-in. When we do get together at events like Rough River, only a couple of people fly, the rest sit around talking. It makes my wonder if we’ve lost sight of the purpose for which we built these airplanes. Isn’t it too fly? 

 

Making your airplane go faster is fun, but you can’t fill your logbook with time in the shop. I know because I’ve spent most of my time tinkering with my airplane when I should’ve been flying. 

 

Fly fast.. but first FLY! 

 

Ryszard 


On Aug 16, 2019, at 22:56, Jeff Barnes jcbarnes411@... [canard-aviators] <canard-aviators@yahoogroups..com> wrote:

 

Some have hooked up X number airspeed indicators

 

 

On Friday, August 16, 2019, 8:04:33 PM PDT, Dave Adams long83dt@... [canard-aviators] <canard-aviators@...> wrote:

 

 

 

 

I’m interested in ideas on how to visualize the flow from cowling inlet to outlet.  The best info would be from those that have come up with something and given it a try.

 

If we place tufts on all pertinent components that are in the flow, and have GoPros, or fiber optics, or other devices observing the tufts, I think we could learn something.  The pertinent components that I’m thinking about are exhaust headers, intake tubes, air box, plug wires, oil pan, carb/throttle body, etc.  Just like Craig Catto’s GoPro video of a tufted propeller blade in different flight regimes showed some big surprises, I’m guessing we would have some surprises inside our cowls too.

 

Would a GoPro camera survive in the heat around an engine?  What is the practical maximum temperature that a GoPro or other small camera could survive?

 

Thanks for any ideas!

 

Dave Adams

Long EZ N83DT

Race 83

 

--



--


Re: Was <In Cowl Flow Visualization > builders v flyers

Bill Allen
 

Burrall is right. I built my LE 34 years ago, and I’ve rebuilt it 3 times, - not from any accident damage, just because I found better ways to do things, engines, panels, fuel systems etc. I was born with a chrome-vanadium wrench in my mouth.
I have a LE with a Diesel engine in which I seem to continually find fresh things to improve, and a CZ4 which had a great steam panel which didn’t have  to be replaced by a Garmin G3X setup.
 If it wasn’t aircraft, it would be cars or boats - in fact it used to be cars/motorsport when I was younger, but what I disliked about motorsport was that you spent time and money getting the machine as good as you could, and then at the weekend when you raced it, either you, or someone else would likely wreck all or part of it, so it would all have to be done again. With an aircraft you aim to get it as close to perfect (there are no perfectly good aircraft) and keep it that way. 
I’ve visited Burrall a couple of times on my trans-USA EZ flights, and his place is a builder paradise!
As to the flying, I seem to fly more when I’m in the US because in the UK the weather is more unpredictable, landing fees high (typ$20) fuel costs c.$9gal and airspace congested. 

Bill Allen
CZ4 G-BYLZ
LE 160 N99BA
LeD G-LEZE
VE N2CR


On Sat, 17 Aug 2019 at 18:54, Burrall Sanders craftsman@... [canard-aviators] <canard-aviators@...> wrote:
 

Ryszard and all,

I put most builders into two groups,  one group BUILDS TO BUILD and loves to tinker and tend have nice looking planes when they are done but, far too many tinkerers never get the plane in the air.  The other group BUILDS TO FLY, they may enjoy the build but the only reason they are building is to fly it. Some of the worst workmanship we at Freeflight have observed has been on planes built by the second group.  And some of the most beautiful hanger queens were built by the first group.  No one should take any  of this personally because I am generalizing a bunch. Me?  Even though Freeflight has produced several Osh Kosh award winners I am in the second group, personally.   In setting out to build my Cozy IIIx I made some goals.  I wanted reliability and performance to be outstanding,  I also wanted a plane that looked good and new when it was but did not care about winning any awards. I did not set out for a show winner and did not get one, but I did get a plane with superb reliability and pretty darn good performance.  Won a few of the canard races at Kanab over the years.

Ryszard is absolutely right about all of them being individual aircraft and what works on one will not necessarily work on another.  That can be difficult to explain to a customer but it is a fact of life.

 

Best,

Burrall

 

 

 

Sent from Mail for Windows 10

 

From: B Smith bsmith51@... [canard-aviators]
Sent: Saturday, August 17, 2019 9:33 AM
To: canard-aviators@yahoogroups..com
Subject: Re: [c-a] In Cowl Flow Visualization

 

 

From my observation, given the daunting task of building a composite aircraft, the ones who complete are, from the start, builders.  Such people are natural tinkerers; it's a calling.  Flying is done not necessarily to go anywhere but to validate the last improvement.

 

On Sat, Aug 17, 2019 at 5:23 AM Ryszard Zadow ryszardzadow@att..net [canard-aviators] <canard-aviators@...> wrote:

 

I got a digital pressure gauge that read inches of water and ran 16 plastic tubes back into the cowlings. Each tube was numbered and I’d swap tubes and take readings.  I was able to “map” pressures around the engine. It confirmed some things that I thought I already knew and made me realize I was way off on others. 

 

One thing we’ve learned doing all this test flying at Jetguys is no two EZs are the same. What makes one cool well doesn’t often work on another. That reinforces how individual these airplanes are. Compare that to cookie-cutter kitplanes.  While attending the FFI formation clinic in Kansas City last spring I made an observation to fellow LongEZ driver Bob Stevens that was also flying there. 65 RVs were in that clinic. The entire weekend none of those guys talked about cooling. None of them bragged about how fast they were or talked about speed mods. They got in their airplanes and FLEW! Their airplanes always started. It was a stark contrast to the EZ community where we can’t get 65 EZs to show up at a fly-in. When we do get together at events like Rough River, only a couple of people fly, the rest sit around talking. It makes my wonder if we’ve lost sight of the purpose for which we built these airplanes. Isn’t it too fly? 

 

Making your airplane go faster is fun, but you can’t fill your logbook with time in the shop. I know because I’ve spent most of my time tinkering with my airplane when I should’ve been flying. 

 

Fly fast.. but first FLY! 

 

Ryszard 


On Aug 16, 2019, at 22:56, Jeff Barnes jcbarnes411@... [canard-aviators] <canard-aviators@yahoogroups..com> wrote:

 

Some have hooked up X number airspeed indicators

 

 

On Friday, August 16, 2019, 8:04:33 PM PDT, Dave Adams long83dt@... [canard-aviators] <canard-aviators@...> wrote:

 

 

 

 

I’m interested in ideas on how to visualize the flow from cowling inlet to outlet.  The best info would be from those that have come up with something and given it a try.

 

If we place tufts on all pertinent components that are in the flow, and have GoPros, or fiber optics, or other devices observing the tufts, I think we could learn something.  The pertinent components that I’m thinking about are exhaust headers, intake tubes, air box, plug wires, oil pan, carb/throttle body, etc.  Just like Craig Catto’s GoPro video of a tufted propeller blade in different flight regimes showed some big surprises, I’m guessing we would have some surprises inside our cowls too.

 

Would a GoPro camera survive in the heat around an engine?  What is the practical maximum temperature that a GoPro or other small camera could survive?

 

Thanks for any ideas!

 

Dave Adams

Long EZ N83DT

Race 83

 

--


Re: In Cowl Flow Visualization

Mike Tooze
 

Hi All,
I was at somewhere, I can't remember where, when a guy was looking over my VE and for some time into the cockpit.
Finally he said. 'It certainly had been used!' to which I replied 'I'll take that as a complement!'
I hope that puts me nearer to Rysz's 'group two' than 'group one' ;^)

Which reminds me years back, of a friend who was cleaning his VE when two schoolboys rode up on their bicycles. Of course in 'cleaning' my friend was invisible to them.
After a time one observed to the other 'They're all made from scrap you know.' - Friend quietly collapses !!!

From which I say, Don't take the 'expert opinion' too much to heart
My 2d
Mike T

On Saturday, 17 August 2019, 16:43:54 BST, Dave Froble davef@... [canard-aviators] wrote:




On 8/17/2019 11:22 AM, B Smith bsmith51@... [canard-aviators] wrote:
>
>
> From my observation, given the daunting task of building a composite
> aircraft, the ones who complete are, from the start, builders.  Such
> people are natural tinkerers; it's a calling.

It takes a lot of dedication to build.  I'm finding this out every day.


>  Flying is done not
> necessarily to go anywhere but to validate the last improvement.


For those who want transportation, take the bus ....

Flying is, for the JOY OF FLIGHT !!!!

--
David Froble                      Tel: 724-529-0450
Dave Froble Enterprises, Inc.      E-Mail: davef@...
DFE Ultralights, Inc.
170 Grimplin Road
Vanderbilt, PA  15486


------------------------------------
Posted by: Dave Froble <davef@...>
------------------------------------


------------------------------------

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Re: In Cowl Flow Visualization

Burrall Sanders
 

Ryszard and all,

I put most builders into two groups,  one group BUILDS TO BUILD and loves to tinker and tend have nice looking planes when they are done but, far too many tinkerers never get the plane in the air.  The other group BUILDS TO FLY, they may enjoy the build but the only reason they are building is to fly it. Some of the worst workmanship we at Freeflight have observed has been on planes built by the second group.  And some of the most beautiful hanger queens were built by the first group.  No one should take any  of this personally because I am generalizing a bunch. Me?  Even though Freeflight has produced several Osh Kosh award winners I am in the second group, personally.   In setting out to build my Cozy IIIx I made some goals.  I wanted reliability and performance to be outstanding,  I also wanted a plane that looked good and new when it was but did not care about winning any awards. I did not set out for a show winner and did not get one, but I did get a plane with superb reliability and pretty darn good performance.  Won a few of the canard races at Kanab over the years.

Ryszard is absolutely right about all of them being individual aircraft and what works on one will not necessarily work on another.  That can be difficult to explain to a customer but it is a fact of life.

 

Best,

Burrall

 

 

 

Sent from Mail for Windows 10

 

From: B Smith bsmith51@... [canard-aviators]
Sent: Saturday, August 17, 2019 9:33 AM
To: canard-aviators@...
Subject: Re: [c-a] In Cowl Flow Visualization

 

 

From my observation, given the daunting task of building a composite aircraft, the ones who complete are, from the start, builders.  Such people are natural tinkerers; it's a calling.  Flying is done not necessarily to go anywhere but to validate the last improvement.

 

On Sat, Aug 17, 2019 at 5:23 AM Ryszard Zadow ryszardzadow@... [canard-aviators] <canard-aviators@...> wrote:

 

I got a digital pressure gauge that read inches of water and ran 16 plastic tubes back into the cowlings. Each tube was numbered and I’d swap tubes and take readings.  I was able to “map” pressures around the engine. It confirmed some things that I thought I already knew and made me realize I was way off on others. 

 

One thing we’ve learned doing all this test flying at Jetguys is no two EZs are the same. What makes one cool well doesn’t often work on another. That reinforces how individual these airplanes are. Compare that to cookie-cutter kitplanes.  While attending the FFI formation clinic in Kansas City last spring I made an observation to fellow LongEZ driver Bob Stevens that was also flying there. 65 RVs were in that clinic. The entire weekend none of those guys talked about cooling. None of them bragged about how fast they were or talked about speed mods. They got in their airplanes and FLEW! Their airplanes always started. It was a stark contrast to the EZ community where we can’t get 65 EZs to show up at a fly-in. When we do get together at events like Rough River, only a couple of people fly, the rest sit around talking. It makes my wonder if we’ve lost sight of the purpose for which we built these airplanes. Isn’t it too fly? 

 

Making your airplane go faster is fun, but you can’t fill your logbook with time in the shop. I know because I’ve spent most of my time tinkering with my airplane when I should’ve been flying. 

 

Fly fast.. but first FLY! 

 

Ryszard 


On Aug 16, 2019, at 22:56, Jeff Barnes jcbarnes411@... [canard-aviators] <canard-aviators@...> wrote:

 

Some have hooked up X number airspeed indicators

 

 

On Friday, August 16, 2019, 8:04:33 PM PDT, Dave Adams long83dt@... [canard-aviators] <canard-aviators@...> wrote:

 

 

 

 

I’m interested in ideas on how to visualize the flow from cowling inlet to outlet.  The best info would be from those that have come up with something and given it a try.

 

If we place tufts on all pertinent components that are in the flow, and have GoPros, or fiber optics, or other devices observing the tufts, I think we could learn something.  The pertinent components that I’m thinking about are exhaust headers, intake tubes, air box, plug wires, oil pan, carb/throttle body, etc.  Just like Craig Catto’s GoPro video of a tufted propeller blade in different flight regimes showed some big surprises, I’m guessing we would have some surprises inside our cowls too.

 

Would a GoPro camera survive in the heat around an engine?  What is the practical maximum temperature that a GoPro or other small camera could survive?

 

Thanks for any ideas!

 

Dave Adams

Long EZ N83DT

Race 83

 


(No subject)

Bob Holliston
 

Cool pic!


On Sat, Aug 17, 2019 at 12:43 AM Christian von Delius alpineglobalprivate@... [canard-aviators] <canard-aviators@...> wrote:
 

We have the same modification to a Piper Aztec; very useful in the shop.
-Christian

--        www.BrilliantDesignOnline.com
Solidworks Design & CNC Plasma Cutting

         -a division of-
www.AlpineWorldwide.com
       "We build ideas.."


On Fri, Aug 16, 2019 at 4:04 PM 'Mike Scovel' ezdriver@... [canard-aviators] <canard-aviators@...> wrote:
 

Nice!!

 

Sincerely,

 

Mike Scovel

SE Michigan

VariEze

 

Mbl     (313) 608-7202

 

Email   ezdriver@...

 

 

 

From: canard-aviators@... <canard-aviators@yahoogroups..com>
Sent: Friday, August 16, 2019 4:56 PM
To: canard <canard-aviators@...>
Subject: [c-a]

 

 

My neighbor who knows how to photoshop sent me this. Low pass, short pilot, EZ retract. 

--



--


Re: In Cowl Flow Visualization

David A Froble
 

On 8/17/2019 11:22 AM, B Smith bsmith51@... [canard-aviators] wrote:


From my observation, given the daunting task of building a composite
aircraft, the ones who complete are, from the start, builders. Such
people are natural tinkerers; it's a calling.
It takes a lot of dedication to build. I'm finding this out every day.

Flying is done not
necessarily to go anywhere but to validate the last improvement.
For those who want transportation, take the bus ....

Flying is, for the JOY OF FLIGHT !!!!

--
David Froble Tel: 724-529-0450
Dave Froble Enterprises, Inc. E-Mail: davef@...
DFE Ultralights, Inc.
170 Grimplin Road
Vanderbilt, PA 15486


Re: In Cowl Flow Visualization

besmith51
 

From my observation, given the daunting task of building a composite aircraft, the ones who complete are, from the start, builders.  Such people are natural tinkerers; it's a calling.  Flying is done not necessarily to go anywhere but to validate the last improvement.


On Sat, Aug 17, 2019 at 5:23 AM Ryszard Zadow ryszardzadow@... [canard-aviators] <canard-aviators@...> wrote:
 

I got a digital pressure gauge that read inches of water and ran 16 plastic tubes back into the cowlings. Each tube was numbered and I’d swap tubes and take readings.  I was able to “map” pressures around the engine. It confirmed some things that I thought I already knew and made me realize I was way off on others. 

One thing we’ve learned doing all this test flying at Jetguys is no two EZs are the same. What makes one cool well doesn’t often work on another. That reinforces how individual these airplanes are. Compare that to cookie-cutter kitplanes.  While attending the FFI formation clinic in Kansas City last spring I made an observation to fellow LongEZ driver Bob Stevens that was also flying there. 65 RVs were in that clinic. The entire weekend none of those guys talked about cooling. None of them bragged about how fast they were or talked about speed mods. They got in their airplanes and FLEW! Their airplanes always started. It was a stark contrast to the EZ community where we can’t get 65 EZs to show up at a fly-in. When we do get together at events like Rough River, only a couple of people fly, the rest sit around talking. It makes my wonder if we’ve lost sight of the purpose for which we built these airplanes. Isn’t it too fly? 

Making your airplane go faster is fun, but you can’t fill your logbook with time in the shop. I know because I’ve spent most of my time tinkering with my airplane when I should’ve been flying. 

Fly fast.. but first FLY! 

Ryszard 

On Aug 16, 2019, at 22:56, Jeff Barnes jcbarnes411@... [canard-aviators] <canard-aviators@...> wrote:

 

Some have hooked up X number airspeed indicators


On Friday, August 16, 2019, 8:04:33 PM PDT, Dave Adams long83dt@... [canard-aviators] <canard-aviators@...> wrote:


 


I’m interested in ideas on how to visualize the flow from cowling inlet to outlet.  The best info would be from those that have come up with something and given it a try.

 

If we place tufts on all pertinent components that are in the flow, and have GoPros, or fiber optics, or other devices observing the tufts, I think we could learn something.  The pertinent components that I’m thinking about are exhaust headers, intake tubes, air box, plug wires, oil pan, carb/throttle body, etc.  Just like Craig Catto’s GoPro video of a tufted propeller blade in different flight regimes showed some big surprises, I’m guessing we would have some surprises inside our cowls too.

 

Would a GoPro camera survive in the heat around an engine?  What is the practical maximum temperature that a GoPro or other small camera could survive?

 

Thanks for any ideas!

 

Dave Adams

Long EZ N83DT

Race 83


Re: Berkut nose wheel

berkut13
 

Nope.  Same as Long-EZ/Cozy III.    The Cozy Mk4 has a larger tire/wheel/fork/lower casting etc.

 

-James

Berkut/Race 13

 

 

From: canard-aviators@... [mailto:canard-aviators@...]
Sent: Friday, August 16, 2019 12:35 PM
To: canard-aviators@...
Subject: [c-a] Berkut nose wheel

 

 

Looking at pictures of Berkuts it appears they use a larger nose wheel than a stock LEZ. Can someone measure the tire diameter and maximum width and post them? Or tell me where to look for that information? 

 

Thanks,

Rick


Re: In Cowl Flow Visualization

Ryszard Zadow
 

I got a digital pressure gauge that read inches of water and ran 16 plastic tubes back into the cowlings. Each tube was numbered and I’d swap tubes and take readings.  I was able to “map” pressures around the engine. It confirmed some things that I thought I already knew and made me realize I was way off on others. 

One thing we’ve learned doing all this test flying at Jetguys is no two EZs are the same. What makes one cool well doesn’t often work on another. That reinforces how individual these airplanes are. Compare that to cookie-cutter kitplanes.  While attending the FFI formation clinic in Kansas City last spring I made an observation to fellow LongEZ driver Bob Stevens that was also flying there. 65 RVs were in that clinic. The entire weekend none of those guys talked about cooling. None of them bragged about how fast they were or talked about speed mods. They got in their airplanes and FLEW! Their airplanes always started. It was a stark contrast to the EZ community where we can’t get 65 EZs to show up at a fly-in. When we do get together at events like Rough River, only a couple of people fly, the rest sit around talking. It makes my wonder if we’ve lost sight of the purpose for which we built these airplanes. Isn’t it too fly? 

Making your airplane go faster is fun, but you can’t fill your logbook with time in the shop. I know because I’ve spent most of my time tinkering with my airplane when I should’ve been flying. 

Fly fast.. but first FLY! 

Ryszard 

On Aug 16, 2019, at 22:56, Jeff Barnes jcbarnes411@... [canard-aviators] <canard-aviators@...> wrote:

 

Some have hooked up X number airspeed indicators


On Friday, August 16, 2019, 8:04:33 PM PDT, Dave Adams long83dt@... [canard-aviators] <canard-aviators@...> wrote:


 


I’m interested in ideas on how to visualize the flow from cowling inlet to outlet.  The best info would be from those that have come up with something and given it a try.

 

If we place tufts on all pertinent components that are in the flow, and have GoPros, or fiber optics, or other devices observing the tufts, I think we could learn something.  The pertinent components that I’m thinking about are exhaust headers, intake tubes, air box, plug wires, oil pan, carb/throttle body, etc.  Just like Craig Catto’s GoPro video of a tufted propeller blade in different flight regimes showed some big surprises, I’m guessing we would have some surprises inside our cowls too.

 

Would a GoPro camera survive in the heat around an engine?  What is the practical maximum temperature that a GoPro or other small camera could survive?

 

Thanks for any ideas!

 

Dave Adams

Long EZ N83DT

Race 83


Re: Nose Wheel Fork Assembly

Filipe Rosa
 

Thank you Dale,

Filipe


(No subject)

 

We have the same modification to a Piper Aztec; very useful in the shop.
-Christian

--        www.BrilliantDesignOnline.com
Solidworks Design & CNC Plasma Cutting

         -a division of-
www.AlpineWorldwide.com
       "We build ideas.."


On Fri, Aug 16, 2019 at 4:04 PM 'Mike Scovel' ezdriver@... [canard-aviators] <canard-aviators@...> wrote:
 

Nice!!

 

Sincerely,

 

Mike Scovel

SE Michigan

VariEze

 

Mbl     (313) 608-7202

 

Email   ezdriver@...

 

 

 

From: canard-aviators@... <canard-aviators@...>
Sent: Friday, August 16, 2019 4:56 PM
To: canard <canard-aviators@...>
Subject: [c-a]

 

 

My neighbor who knows how to photoshop sent me this. Low pass, short pilot, EZ retract. 

--


Re: In Cowl Flow Visualization

Jeff Barnes
 

Some have hooked up X number airspeed indicators


On Friday, August 16, 2019, 8:04:33 PM PDT, Dave Adams long83dt@... [canard-aviators] <canard-aviators@...> wrote:


 


I’m interested in ideas on how to visualize the flow from cowling inlet to outlet.  The best info would be from those that have come up with something and given it a try.

 

If we place tufts on all pertinent components that are in the flow, and have GoPros, or fiber optics, or other devices observing the tufts, I think we could learn something.  The pertinent components that I’m thinking about are exhaust headers, intake tubes, air box, plug wires, oil pan, carb/throttle body, etc.  Just like Craig Catto’s GoPro video of a tufted propeller blade in different flight regimes showed some big surprises, I’m guessing we would have some surprises inside our cowls too.

 

Would a GoPro camera survive in the heat around an engine?  What is the practical maximum temperature that a GoPro or other small camera could survive?

 

Thanks for any ideas!

 

Dave Adams

Long EZ N83DT

Race 83


Re: In Cowl Flow Visualization

Tony Rothwell
 

A heck of a lot cheaper and far smaller than a go-pro..................


You can use it as a borescope too.


On Sat, 17 Aug 2019 at 13:16, 'Ryszardzadow@...' ryszardzadow@... [canard-aviators] <canard-aviators@...> wrote:
 

Get a little app called “Wind Tunnel Free”. It won’t get you specifics of your installation but it’s a very basic program that’s a fun way to visualize flow and a good start. 

RZ 

On Aug 16, 2019, at 9:26 PM, Dave Adams long83dt@... [canard-aviators] <canard-aviators@...> wrote:

 


I’m interested in ideas on how to visualize the flow from cowling inlet to outlet.  The best info would be from those that have come up with something and given it a try.

 

If we place tufts on all pertinent components that are in the flow, and have GoPros, or fiber optics, or other devices observing the tufts, I think we could learn something.  The pertinent components that I’m thinking about are exhaust headers, intake tubes, air box, plug wires, oil pan, carb/throttle body, etc.  Just like Craig Catto’s GoPro video of a tufted propeller blade in different flight regimes showed some big surprises, I’m guessing we would have some surprises inside our cowls too.

 

Would a GoPro camera survive in the heat around an engine?  What is the practical maximum temperature that a GoPro or other small camera could survive?

 

Thanks for any ideas!

 

Dave Adams

Long EZ N83DT

Race 83


Re: In Cowl Flow Visualization

Ryszard Zadow
 

Get a little app called “Wind Tunnel Free”. It won’t get you specifics of your installation but it’s a very basic program that’s a fun way to visualize flow and a good start. 

RZ 

On Aug 16, 2019, at 9:26 PM, Dave Adams long83dt@... [canard-aviators] <canard-aviators@...> wrote:

 


I’m interested in ideas on how to visualize the flow from cowling inlet to outlet.  The best info would be from those that have come up with something and given it a try.

 

If we place tufts on all pertinent components that are in the flow, and have GoPros, or fiber optics, or other devices observing the tufts, I think we could learn something.  The pertinent components that I’m thinking about are exhaust headers, intake tubes, air box, plug wires, oil pan, carb/throttle body, etc.  Just like Craig Catto’s GoPro video of a tufted propeller blade in different flight regimes showed some big surprises, I’m guessing we would have some surprises inside our cowls too.

 

Would a GoPro camera survive in the heat around an engine?  What is the practical maximum temperature that a GoPro or other small camera could survive?

 

Thanks for any ideas!

 

Dave Adams

Long EZ N83DT

Race 83

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