Date   

Re: VM1000 to Garmin G3X / GEA-24 conversion

Daryl Lueck
 

Hi Jim,
  I did the same mod in my Cozy IV 5 years ago.  The only sensor I reused was my fuel flow sensor.  I used the Flowscan sensor, a Red Cube would not work for some odd reason.   I don’t see why the egt and cylinder head probes wouldn’t work.  
  The installation manual shows all of the config options for the G3X.

   Daryl
    Cozy IV N797DL


On Nov 17, 2019, at 3:09 PM, Jim Rodrian <Jim.Rodrian@...> wrote:

A panel upgrade for my Defiant will include replacing two, working VM1000 engine monitors with a Garmin G3X and two GEA-24 Engine/Airframe interfaces.  Has anyone done a similar upgrade?  Does anyone have first-hand knowledge regarding which VM1000 sensors can be connected directly to the GEA-24 with no custom programming of sensor characteristics?

Jim R.
Defiant N403R


Re: VM1000 to Garmin G3X / GEA-24 conversion

Kevin R. Walsh
 

On Mon, Nov 18, 2019 at 9:35 AM Daryl Lueck <cozypilot@...> wrote:
I used the Flowscan sensor, a Red Cube would not work for some odd reason.  

I have the red cube on my G3X install and it has worked perfectly since initial installation.  So if you have the Red Cube, it should work.   

--
Kevin


Canard Zone Web Forums and Mailing List integration

Jon Matcho
 

Hello, I want to clarify some following points made in a separate thread on the Canard Aviators mailing list:

Bruce Hughes wrote: I think your question is automatically transferred to Canardzone.

Close, but not entirely accurate. The Canard Zone has read-only subforums that allow members to read (but not reply to ) messages posted in various canard-related mailing lists like this one.

Bruce also wrote: I think most of the guys that were using "canard-aviators" from Yahoogroups have moved over to CanardZone.

While there are both mailing list and online members, from what I can tell the Canard Aviators and Defiant Flyers mailing lists haven't missed a beat.

With all this said, the goal is to move towards a single membership between the Canard Zone and various mailing lists to allow a seamless posting and membership experience. There are a number of challenges to make this happen, including technology and logistics, even making it doubtful this can actually happen within a reasonable amount of work. Until then, posting to these mailing lists remains separate from one's membership and posts at the Canard Zone.

Everyone is welcome to join the Canard Zone -- please do, as there are often questions that would benefit from additional expertise such as yours.

Thank you,
Jon


Jon Matcho
Builder / Administrator

jonmatcho@...
Repairing Quickie TriQ-200 N479E
Building a Cozy Mark IV
www.canardzone.com
www.quickheads.com


Dynon Xponder and HDX wiring

Scott Fish
 

Thought I'd give the new canard zone a try with a question I've been searching on today without success:

 I've got a Dynon Xponder 261 (2020 ADSB-OUT compliant) and a Dynon HDX display and Dynon's GPS 2020.  The wiring for the Xponder shows a serial interface with the HDX in both directions and it appears to be working in the sense that it provides ALT out, but I've not checked with others in flight yet to see if I'm showing up on their ADSB-IN displays.  

Here's my question:  The Xponder wiring diagram also shows an optional GPS data input to the Xponder that I've not wired yet.  Does the Dynon Xponder 261 get it's GPS information from the HDX (which most definitely has the GPS wired to it) over the HDX<->Xponder serial port, or do I have to wire this external GPS input in addition to the HDX serial lines to get the full benefit of GPS over the ADSB-OUT functionality of the Xponder?

Thanks,

Scott Fish
Cozy MKIV  N78CZ


Re: Dynon Xponder and HDX wiring

Marc J. Zeitlin
 

Scott Fish wrote:

Thought I'd give the new canard zone a try...

Geez - please just use canard-aviators and/or the COZY mailing list, or the canardzone via the forum interface. How many places do we have to monitor to discuss canards? It's already ridiculous...

Here's my question:  The Xponder wiring diagram also shows an optional GPS data input to the Xponder that I've not wired yet.  Does the Dynon Xponder 261 get it's GPS information from the HDX (which most definitely has the GPS wired to it) over the HDX<->Xponder serial port, or do I have to wire this external GPS input in addition to the HDX serial lines to get the full benefit of GPS over the ADSB-OUT functionality of the Xponder?

The SV-XPNDR-261/262 chapter, page 11-11 of the Skyview Installation Manual clearly addresses this question. You don't have to wire the external GPS input if you have the GPS-2020 installed.

--
Marc J. Zeitlin                      marc_zeitlin@...
                                            http://www.cozybuilders.org/
Copyright © 2019                     Burnside Aerospace


Re: Dynon Xponder and HDX wiring

Jon Matcho
 

Marc Zeitlin wrote:   Geez - please just use canard-aviators and/or the COZY mailing list, or the canardzone via the forum interface. How many places do we have to monitor to discuss canards? It's already ridiculous...

 

You are misinformed of what Scott just did with his original post.  By posting to the top-level list, Scott was able to send a valid question to both the Canard Aviators AND Defiant Flyers lists without cross-posting.

 

Here’s the structure of the mailing lists, with each having an email address:

 

 

Why not consider moving the Cozy mailing list to be a third group here so that we can avoid the cross-posting mayhem that happens, where email subjects end up with nearly unreadable subject lines, for example “Re: Re: [C-A] Dynon Question Re: COZY: Dynon Question” – now that is ridiculous!  I’d be happy to work with you on that so you can manage the Cozy Mailing List membership exactly as you do today.  Now that would be a step in the right direction for everyone – one place to sign up for mailing lists.

 

Regards,

Jon

 

 

Jon Matcho

Builder / Administrator

 

jonmatcho@...

Repairing Quickie TriQ-200

Building a Cozy Mark IV

www.canardzone.com

www.quickheads.com

 


Re: Dynon Xponder and HDX wiring

KEN4ZZ
 

Hi Scott- Since no one else has chimed in, I'll give it a shot.  From the SkyView installation manual, revision AD, page 11-11:

"Direct Serial GPS Position Input (Pin 3) Prior to 2016, the only way for a SkyView system to comply with the FAA 2020 ADS-B Out mandate was to connect a serial output from a certified GPS to the Direct Serial GPS Position Input (Pin 3). As of January, 2016, Dynon Avionics offers the SV-GPS-2020 GPS Antenna/Receiver Module which provides high-integrity GPS data compliant with the FAA 2020 ADS-B Out mandate. The SV-GPS-2020 transmits high-integrity GPS position data to the SkyView display(s), which then transmit the high-integrity GPS position data to the SV-XPNDR-261/262.
Thus, if an SV-GPS-2020 is installed, this input is not used. "

As it says, since you have the SV-GPS-2020 installed on your system, pin 3 is not used.  Your 261 transponder will get all the position data it needs to be 2020 compliant thru whichever serial port (#1 - #4, since #5 is generally recommended for connecting your SV-GPS-2020) you chose to connect it to the rest of your system.

If you had the older (non-2020 compliant) SV-GPS-250 for your system, but also had a WAAS IFR GPS navigation unit (Garmin 430/530W, Avidyne 440/ 540, etc.) installed, you could route a position signal from that WAAS to pin 3 to become 2020 compliant.


Ken

On 11/27/2019 4:37 PM, scottbcs@... wrote:
Thought I'd give the new canard zone a try with a question I've been searching on today without success:

 I've got a Dynon Xponder 261 (2020 ADSB-OUT compliant) and a Dynon HDX display and Dynon's GPS 2020.  The wiring for the Xponder shows a serial interface with the HDX in both directions and it appears to be working in the sense that it provides ALT out, but I've not checked with others in flight yet to see if I'm showing up on their ADSB-IN displays.  

Here's my question:  The Xponder wiring diagram also shows an optional GPS data input to the Xponder that I've not wired yet.  Does the Dynon Xponder 261 get it's GPS information from the HDX (which most definitely has the GPS wired to it) over the HDX<->Xponder serial port, or do I have to wire this external GPS input in addition to the HDX serial lines to get the full benefit of GPS over the ADSB-OUT functionality of the Xponder?

Thanks,

Scott Fish
Cozy MKIV  N78CZ


Re: Dynon Xponder and HDX wiring

Scott Fish
 

Thanks Ken.  

I was reading the right material in the Install manual, but was just not positive about it’s interpretation.  I appreciate the time you committed to explain.  

Best and happy Thanksgiving,

Scott


On Nov 28, 2019, at 1:00 PM, KEN4ZZ via Groups.Io <ken4zz@...> wrote:

Hi Scott- Since no one else has chimed in, I'll give it a shot.  From the SkyView installation manual, revision AD, page 11-11:

"Direct Serial GPS Position Input (Pin 3) Prior to 2016, the only way for a SkyView system to comply with the FAA 2020 ADS-B Out mandate was to connect a serial output from a certified GPS to the Direct Serial GPS Position Input (Pin 3). As of January, 2016, Dynon Avionics offers the SV-GPS-2020 GPS Antenna/Receiver Module which provides high-integrity GPS data compliant with the FAA 2020 ADS-B Out mandate. The SV-GPS-2020 transmits high-integrity GPS position data to the SkyView display(s), which then transmit the high-integrity GPS position data to the SV-XPNDR-261/262.
Thus, if an SV-GPS-2020 is installed, this input is not used. "

As it says, since you have the SV-GPS-2020 installed on your system, pin 3 is not used.  Your 261 transponder will get all the position data it needs to be 2020 compliant thru whichever serial port (#1 - #4, since #5 is generally recommended for connecting your SV-GPS-2020) you chose to connect it to the rest of your system.

If you had the older (non-2020 compliant) SV-GPS-250 for your system, but also had a WAAS IFR GPS navigation unit (Garmin 430/530W, Avidyne 440/ 540, etc.) installed, you could route a position signal from that WAAS to pin 3 to become 2020 compliant.


Ken

On 11/27/2019 4:37 PM, scottbcs@... wrote:
Thought I'd give the new canard zone a try with a question I've been searching on today without success:

 I've got a Dynon Xponder 261 (2020 ADSB-OUT compliant) and a Dynon HDX display and Dynon's GPS 2020.  The wiring for the Xponder shows a serial interface with the HDX in both directions and it appears to be working in the sense that it provides ALT out, but I've not checked with others in flight yet to see if I'm showing up on their ADSB-IN displays.  

Here's my question:  The Xponder wiring diagram also shows an optional GPS data input to the Xponder that I've not wired yet.  Does the Dynon Xponder 261 get it's GPS information from the HDX (which most definitely has the GPS wired to it) over the HDX<->Xponder serial port, or do I have to wire this external GPS input in addition to the HDX serial lines to get the full benefit of GPS over the ADSB-OUT functionality of the Xponder?

Thanks,

Scott Fish
Cozy MKIV  N78CZ


Re: Dynon Xponder and HDX wiring

A R Goldman
 

You can connect it to pin 3, however not directly. You need to put a resistor of relatively specific value ( can’t remember the value but it is in the instal instructions—- the value given is really wierd but dynon told me rounding is ok-check to insure ) in series with the connection. 

Rich



On Nov 28, 2019, at 11:00 AM, KEN4ZZ via Groups.Io <ken4zz@...> wrote:

Hi Scott- Since no one else has chimed in, I'll give it a shot.  From the SkyView installation manual, revision AD, page 11-11:

"Direct Serial GPS Position Input (Pin 3) Prior to 2016, the only way for a SkyView system to comply with the FAA 2020 ADS-B Out mandate was to connect a serial output from a certified GPS to the Direct Serial GPS Position Input (Pin 3). As of January, 2016, Dynon Avionics offers the SV-GPS-2020 GPS Antenna/Receiver Module which provides high-integrity GPS data compliant with the FAA 2020 ADS-B Out mandate. The SV-GPS-2020 transmits high-integrity GPS position data to the SkyView display(s), which then transmit the high-integrity GPS position data to the SV-XPNDR-261/262.
Thus, if an SV-GPS-2020 is installed, this input is not used. "

As it says, since you have the SV-GPS-2020 installed on your system, pin 3 is not used.  Your 261 transponder will get all the position data it needs to be 2020 compliant thru whichever serial port (#1 - #4, since #5 is generally recommended for connecting your SV-GPS-2020) you chose to connect it to the rest of your system.

If you had the older (non-2020 compliant) SV-GPS-250 for your system, but also had a WAAS IFR GPS navigation unit (Garmin 430/530W, Avidyne 440/ 540, etc.) installed, you could route a position signal from that WAAS to pin 3 to become 2020 compliant.


Ken

On 11/27/2019 4:37 PM, scottbcs@... wrote:
Thought I'd give the new canard zone a try with a question I've been searching on today without success:

 I've got a Dynon Xponder 261 (2020 ADSB-OUT compliant) and a Dynon HDX display and Dynon's GPS 2020.  The wiring for the Xponder shows a serial interface with the HDX in both directions and it appears to be working in the sense that it provides ALT out, but I've not checked with others in flight yet to see if I'm showing up on their ADSB-IN displays.  

Here's my question:  The Xponder wiring diagram also shows an optional GPS data input to the Xponder that I've not wired yet.  Does the Dynon Xponder 261 get it's GPS information from the HDX (which most definitely has the GPS wired to it) over the HDX<->Xponder serial port, or do I have to wire this external GPS input in addition to the HDX serial lines to get the full benefit of GPS over the ADSB-OUT functionality of the Xponder?

Thanks,

Scott Fish
Cozy MKIV  N78CZ


Re: Dynon Xponder and HDX wiring

A R Goldman
 

Additionally 


the operating system of the garmin must be the latest version to work

I have it wired but have to update my 430w operating system to make it work. Looking at the cost of updating... for 100 or slightly more you can get the proper GPS receiver from dynon if you are really anal retentive you can do both

That’s what I think I will do in which case I will have the older dynon GPS receiver for sale at an attractive price

Rich


On Nov 28, 2019, at 2:01 PM, scottbcs@... wrote:

Thanks Ken.  

I was reading the right material in the Install manual, but was just not positive about it’s interpretation.  I appreciate the time you committed to explain.  

Best and happy Thanksgiving,

Scott


On Nov 28, 2019, at 1:00 PM, KEN4ZZ via Groups.Io <ken4zz@...> wrote:

Hi Scott- Since no one else has chimed in, I'll give it a shot.  From the SkyView installation manual, revision AD, page 11-11:

"Direct Serial GPS Position Input (Pin 3) Prior to 2016, the only way for a SkyView system to comply with the FAA 2020 ADS-B Out mandate was to connect a serial output from a certified GPS to the Direct Serial GPS Position Input (Pin 3). As of January, 2016, Dynon Avionics offers the SV-GPS-2020 GPS Antenna/Receiver Module which provides high-integrity GPS data compliant with the FAA 2020 ADS-B Out mandate. The SV-GPS-2020 transmits high-integrity GPS position data to the SkyView display(s), which then transmit the high-integrity GPS position data to the SV-XPNDR-261/262.
Thus, if an SV-GPS-2020 is installed, this input is not used. "

As it says, since you have the SV-GPS-2020 installed on your system, pin 3 is not used.  Your 261 transponder will get all the position data it needs to be 2020 compliant thru whichever serial port (#1 - #4, since #5 is generally recommended for connecting your SV-GPS-2020) you chose to connect it to the rest of your system.

If you had the older (non-2020 compliant) SV-GPS-250 for your system, but also had a WAAS IFR GPS navigation unit (Garmin 430/530W, Avidyne 440/ 540, etc.) installed, you could route a position signal from that WAAS to pin 3 to become 2020 compliant.


Ken

On 11/27/2019 4:37 PM, scottbcs@... wrote:
Thought I'd give the new canard zone a try with a question I've been searching on today without success:

 I've got a Dynon Xponder 261 (2020 ADSB-OUT compliant) and a Dynon HDX display and Dynon's GPS 2020.  The wiring for the Xponder shows a serial interface with the HDX in both directions and it appears to be working in the sense that it provides ALT out, but I've not checked with others in flight yet to see if I'm showing up on their ADSB-IN displays.  

Here's my question:  The Xponder wiring diagram also shows an optional GPS data input to the Xponder that I've not wired yet.  Does the Dynon Xponder 261 get it's GPS information from the HDX (which most definitely has the GPS wired to it) over the HDX<->Xponder serial port, or do I have to wire this external GPS input in addition to the HDX serial lines to get the full benefit of GPS over the ADSB-OUT functionality of the Xponder?

Thanks,

Scott Fish
Cozy MKIV  N78CZ


Re: Dynon Xponder and HDX wiring

KEN4ZZ
 

Yea, the resistor is 1.21 k.  Didn't know older 430Ws needed updates.  I'm in the process of installing an Avidyne unit and will probably install a GPS out wire when I build the harness.  I installed the SV-GPS-2020 last year, but it's so easy to add the wire when building the harness it's good to have options if my 2020 goes tango uniform.

On 11/28/2019 5:19 PM, A R Goldman via Groups.Io wrote:
Additionally 


the operating system of the garmin must be the latest version to work

I have it wired but have to update my 430w operating system to make it work. Looking at the cost of updating... for 100 or slightly more you can get the proper GPS receiver from dynon if you are really anal retentive you can do both

That’s what I think I will do in which case I will have the older dynon GPS receiver for sale at an attractive price

Rich


On Nov 28, 2019, at 2:01 PM, scottbcs@... wrote:

Thanks Ken.  

I was reading the right material in the Install manual, but was just not positive about it’s interpretation.  I appreciate the time you committed to explain.  

Best and happy Thanksgiving,

Scott


On Nov 28, 2019, at 1:00 PM, KEN4ZZ via Groups.Io <ken4zz@...> wrote:

Hi Scott- Since no one else has chimed in, I'll give it a shot.  From the SkyView installation manual, revision AD, page 11-11:

"Direct Serial GPS Position Input (Pin 3) Prior to 2016, the only way for a SkyView system to comply with the FAA 2020 ADS-B Out mandate was to connect a serial output from a certified GPS to the Direct Serial GPS Position Input (Pin 3). As of January, 2016, Dynon Avionics offers the SV-GPS-2020 GPS Antenna/Receiver Module which provides high-integrity GPS data compliant with the FAA 2020 ADS-B Out mandate. The SV-GPS-2020 transmits high-integrity GPS position data to the SkyView display(s), which then transmit the high-integrity GPS position data to the SV-XPNDR-261/262.
Thus, if an SV-GPS-2020 is installed, this input is not used. "

As it says, since you have the SV-GPS-2020 installed on your system, pin 3 is not used.  Your 261 transponder will get all the position data it needs to be 2020 compliant thru whichever serial port (#1 - #4, since #5 is generally recommended for connecting your SV-GPS-2020) you chose to connect it to the rest of your system.

If you had the older (non-2020 compliant) SV-GPS-250 for your system, but also had a WAAS IFR GPS navigation unit (Garmin 430/530W, Avidyne 440/ 540, etc.) installed, you could route a position signal from that WAAS to pin 3 to become 2020 compliant.


Ken

On 11/27/2019 4:37 PM, scottbcs@... wrote:
Thought I'd give the new canard zone a try with a question I've been searching on today without success:

 I've got a Dynon Xponder 261 (2020 ADSB-OUT compliant) and a Dynon HDX display and Dynon's GPS 2020.  The wiring for the Xponder shows a serial interface with the HDX in both directions and it appears to be working in the sense that it provides ALT out, but I've not checked with others in flight yet to see if I'm showing up on their ADSB-IN displays.  

Here's my question:  The Xponder wiring diagram also shows an optional GPS data input to the Xponder that I've not wired yet.  Does the Dynon Xponder 261 get it's GPS information from the HDX (which most definitely has the GPS wired to it) over the HDX<->Xponder serial port, or do I have to wire this external GPS input in addition to the HDX serial lines to get the full benefit of GPS over the ADSB-OUT functionality of the Xponder?

Thanks,

Scott Fish
Cozy MKIV  N78CZ


Baggage pods - test flying

Dave
 

Does anyone have a test flying protocol for baggage pods to use during phase one testing?

I have the excellent Kevin Walsh document to adapt for my Long-EZ.
I'll be using Dale's 'Cozy size pods' for my Long-EZ build.

Dave
Flying LE VH-JZE and building
LE VH-XEZ


--
*********************************************************
David Berenholtz, Director
Southside Industries (Aust) Pty.Ltd.
P.O. Box 255 Black Rock Vic 3193 Australia

voice: + 61 3 9598 3000
email:   335dave@...
*********************************************************


Re: Baggage pods - test flying

Marc J. Zeitlin
 

Dave Berenholz wrote:

Does anyone have a test flying protocol for baggage pods to use during phase one testing?
I have the excellent Kevin Walsh document to adapt for my Long-EZ.

Assuming you follow Kevin's document, theoretically you'd need to repeat a substantial # of the tests both without and then with pods installed. These would include (but are probably not limited to) stall tests, climb tests, glide tests, stability tests, and flutter tests. Basically, anything that the aerodynamics and weight distribution of the pods might affect.

Most people don't do this when installing pods, of course, but most people seem not to do much in the way of testing in Phase I - they fly around in circles for 40 hours at a mid-CG, mid-weight condition and then call it good. Very disappointing. Be better than that.

--
Marc J. Zeitlin                      marc_zeitlin@...
                                            http://www.cozybuilders.org/
Copyright © 2019                     Burnside Aerospace


Re: Baggage pods - test flying

Tony Rothwell
 

Hi Dave, talk to Chris Burns in Bowral.  Tony 


On Sat., 7 Dec. 2019, 06:59 Dave, <335dave@...> wrote:
Does anyone have a test flying protocol for baggage pods to use during phase one testing?

I have the excellent Kevin Walsh document to adapt for my Long-EZ.
I'll be using Dale's 'Cozy size pods' for my Long-EZ build.

Dave
Flying LE VH-JZE and building
LE VH-XEZ


--
*********************************************************
David Berenholtz, Director
Southside Industries (Aust) Pty.Ltd.
P.O. Box 255 Black Rock Vic 3193 Australia

voice: + 61 3 9598 3000
email:   335dave@...
*********************************************************


Re: Baggage pods - test flying

Tony Rothwell
 

Chris Byrne.... Damn spell check.


On Sat., 7 Dec. 2019, 11:50 Tony Rothwell via Groups.Io, <tony13rothwell=gmail.com@groups.io> wrote:
Hi Dave, talk to Chris Burns in Bowral.  Tony 

On Sat., 7 Dec. 2019, 06:59 Dave, <335dave@...> wrote:
Does anyone have a test flying protocol for baggage pods to use during phase one testing?

I have the excellent Kevin Walsh document to adapt for my Long-EZ.
I'll be using Dale's 'Cozy size pods' for my Long-EZ build.

Dave
Flying LE VH-JZE and building
LE VH-XEZ


--
*********************************************************
David Berenholtz, Director
Southside Industries (Aust) Pty.Ltd.
P.O. Box 255 Black Rock Vic 3193 Australia

voice: + 61 3 9598 3000
email:   335dave@...
*********************************************************


Re: Baggage pods - test flying

Dave
 

re Baggage Pods

Further to Marc's reply, can any user of baggage pods give me a heads up on what changes they noticed with and without them in flight? Perhaps also full (heavy) vs empty. This may have me more prepared when testing.

Thanks!
Dave

Flying LE VH-JZE and building LE VH-XEZ


On Sat, Dec 7, 2019 at 12:43 PM Marc J. Zeitlin <marc.j.zeitlin@...> wrote:
Dave Berenholz wrote:

Does anyone have a test flying protocol for baggage pods to use during phase one testing?
I have the excellent Kevin Walsh document to adapt for my Long-EZ.

Assuming you follow Kevin's document, theoretically you'd need to repeat a substantial # of the tests both without and then with pods installed. These would include (but are probably not limited to) stall tests, climb tests, glide tests, stability tests, and flutter tests. Basically, anything that the aerodynamics and weight distribution of the pods might affect.

Most people don't do this when installing pods, of course, but most people seem not to do much in the way of testing in Phase I - they fly around in circles for 40 hours at a mid-CG, mid-weight condition and then call it good. Very disappointing. Be better than that.

--
Marc J. Zeitlin                      marc_zeitlin@...
                                            http://www.cozybuilders.org/
Copyright © 2019                     Burnside Aerospace



--
*********************************************************
David Berenholtz, Director
Southside Industries (Aust) Pty.Ltd.
P.O. Box 255 Black Rock Vic 3193 Australia

voice: + 61 3 9598 3000
email:   335dave@...
*********************************************************


Re: Baggage pods - test flying

Marc J. Zeitlin
 

Dave Berenhotlz wrote:

... can any user of baggage pods give me a heads up on what changes they noticed with and without them in flight? Perhaps also full (heavy) vs empty.

As you would expect, the pods add weight and drag, as well as some roll inertia. Not a lot of weight by themselves, and not a lot of weight even when loaded with the 25 lb. allowable in each. So maybe 75 lb. total, located about on the CG. You won't notice much of an effect from the weight.

But they certainly add drag. The EZ's and COZY's I've flown with and without pods seem to be about 7 KTAS slower at altitude (+/- 3 KTAS) with the pods on them, and climb a few hundred fpm slower than without pods. YMMV a bit.

If you can notice a roll response difference with the pods vs. without them, then you're a better test pilot than I am (not saying much, of course - I'm not a test pilot). While they are outboard of the strakes, so outboard of the fuel tanks, they only hold 25 lb (plus their own weight), so they're the equivalent of maybe 6 gallons of gas. Not a lot of extra inertia, but some.

There are a couple of folks that have claimed that the pods made them go faster by a few kts. This, of course, is complete nonsense, and speaks to a lack of accurate data gathering ability. There's no way that adding drag to a plane makes it faster, obviously. There were some interesting theories as to why their planes went faster with the pods :-).

--
Marc J. Zeitlin                      marc_zeitlin@...
                                            http://www.cozybuilders.org/
Copyright © 2019                     Burnside Aerospace


Re: Baggage pods - test flying

Keith Spreuer
 

Many claim they add roll stability by straightening the air flow. Possible but I'm skeptical 


On Sat, Dec 7, 2019, 3:47 PM Marc J. Zeitlin <marc.j.zeitlin@...> wrote:
Dave Berenhotlz wrote:

... can any user of baggage pods give me a heads up on what changes they noticed with and without them in flight? Perhaps also full (heavy) vs empty.

As you would expect, the pods add weight and drag, as well as some roll inertia. Not a lot of weight by themselves, and not a lot of weight even when loaded with the 25 lb. allowable in each. So maybe 75 lb. total, located about on the CG. You won't notice much of an effect from the weight.

But they certainly add drag. The EZ's and COZY's I've flown with and without pods seem to be about 7 KTAS slower at altitude (+/- 3 KTAS) with the pods on them, and climb a few hundred fpm slower than without pods. YMMV a bit.

If you can notice a roll response difference with the pods vs. without them, then you're a better test pilot than I am (not saying much, of course - I'm not a test pilot). While they are outboard of the strakes, so outboard of the fuel tanks, they only hold 25 lb (plus their own weight), so they're the equivalent of maybe 6 gallons of gas. Not a lot of extra inertia, but some.

There are a couple of folks that have claimed that the pods made them go faster by a few kts. This, of course, is complete nonsense, and speaks to a lack of accurate data gathering ability. There's no way that adding drag to a plane makes it faster, obviously. There were some interesting theories as to why their planes went faster with the pods :-).

--
Marc J. Zeitlin                      marc_zeitlin@...
                                            http://www.cozybuilders.org/
Copyright © 2019                     Burnside Aerospace


Re: Baggage pods - test flying

Marc J. Zeitlin
 

Keith Spreuer wrote:

Many claim they add roll stability by straightening the air flow. Possible but I'm skeptical

I don't even know what that means - roll stability... They're about on the CG, so even though they add area, they won't affect pitch or yaw (directional) stability much, if any.

But the spiral (roll stability) mode in these planes is generally negative and non-oscillatory, meaning that eventually, the plane will fall off to one side or the other and the roll angle will continue increasing if not corrected by the pilot. "Straightening the airflow" means nothing in this context.

So I'm with you - skeptical, at best.

--
Marc J. Zeitlin                      marc_zeitlin@...
                                            http://www.cozybuilders.org/
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Hangar Insurance

William Silva
 

Can anyone advise what type of policy, and with whom they are insured with, for “a builders’ policy”. Not looking for coverage for a completed “flying” aircraft, but rather liability only protecting the airport and city/county operating it and demanding it.
Not that concerned about covering the aircraft, my tools or equipment, although would be willing to look at that depending on costs. I’ve been an EAA member for 30 years. AOPA does not want to touch it. They declined me yesterday. Both Falcon and Avemco want to insure my “build”, as a “flying aircraft”.....
Along with terminating all prior hangar agreements in effect at my airport, and of course an appreciable increase in rents, my city is requiring a “general liability” policy with $1 million/$100,000. coverage, not in motion, ground only.

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