Topics

Flush door handles


Doug Kan
 

Anybody know of a good and hopefully inexpensive flush door handle for a LongEz. Maybe something like the Tesla door handle?


aviationeyes
 

On Sun, Jan 19, 2020, at 1:56 PM, Doug Kan wrote:
Anybody know of a good and hopefully inexpensive flush door handle for a LongEz. Maybe something like the Tesla door handle?

-- 
  
  skyeyecorp@...



Nick U
 

I found the rotary latch from www.eznoselift.com to be an easy install and works great.  I was able to close off the door, and now only have a small hole in the side of the plane for the key.  It works with the existing LGEZ hardware too.


---------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Nick Ugolini, www.nickugolini.com  
Charleston, SC 

LongEZ N29TM (for sale)
Cozy 4, N826ER











On Jan 19, 2020, at 1:56 PM, Doug Kan <doug@...> wrote:

Anybody know of a good and hopefully inexpensive flush door handle for a LongEz. Maybe something like the Tesla door handle?


Ron Springer
 

I have the rotary latch and I both like it and hate it. On my first flight with it, it slowly walked itself open during climbout and tried to kill me. Luckily the safety catch did its job. On the ground, I can sit in the plane with it latched and push up as hard as I want and the canopy won't budge. But, in an environment with vibration and buffeting, it can rotate itself open.

It depends on being over center and/or friction to stop it from rotating open. I don't think you should depend on a canopy being held closed by those things. I discovered that I am not the only one that has experienced this problem. It needs to have a real locking mechanism. I modified mine so it can't happen again.


Ron


On Tue, Jan 21, 2020 at 12:11 PM Nick U <unick3@...> wrote:
I found the rotary latch from www.eznoselift.com to be an easy install and works great.  I was able to close off the door, and now only have a small hole in the side of the plane for the key.  It works with the existing LGEZ hardware too.


---------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Nick Ugolini, www.nickugolini.com  
Charleston, SC 

LongEZ N29TM (for sale)
Cozy 4, N826ER











On Jan 19, 2020, at 1:56 PM, Doug Kan <doug@...> wrote:

Anybody know of a good and hopefully inexpensive flush door handle for a LongEz. Maybe something like the Tesla door handle?


Kevin R. Walsh
 

I have that Hendricks latch, heavily modified, on my Cozy IV.  It is very pretty, flush from the outside, over-center on the inside, and works great.  I purchased a right hand latch, flipped it upside down, and then machined entirely new internals for it so the over-center works properly.  I even anodized it red, laser etched the LOCKED and OPEN arrow, so it looks very snazzy.

Take a look here, about halfway down: https://goo.gl/photos/LdNGQj6DSLbQvESy6

And I would never do it again.  It is a pain in the ass to get it right.  I think I made 3 or 4 of them before I was happy with it.  If anyone wants the CAD file, I think I have it somewhere on my old laptop.  If I were to do it again I would just do what Marc Zeitlin has on his plane, which is to say there is no external latch.  The internal latch gets stopped by the key lock, and the rest of the internals are plans or very close to plans.



On Tue, Jan 21, 2020 at 6:07 AM aviationeyes <skyeyecorp@...> wrote:
You mean like this one....?

Buy me one!
--Jose


On Sun, Jan 19, 2020, at 1:56 PM, Doug Kan wrote:
Anybody know of a good and hopefully inexpensive flush door handle for a LongEz. Maybe something like the Tesla door handle?

-- 
  




--
Kevin


nosedragger48154
 

Ron, how did you modify it so it would not open in flight?

 

Sincerely,

 

Mike Scovel

SE Michigan

VariEze

 

Mbl     (313) 608-7202

Email   ezdriver@...

Email   info@...

             http://www.brighterstick.com

 

 

 

From: members@canardzone.groups.io <members@canardzone.groups.io> On Behalf Of Ron Springer
Sent: Tuesday, January 21, 2020 12:48 PM
To: members@canardzone.groups.io
Subject: Re: [Canard Zone] Flush door handles

 

I have the rotary latch and I both like it and hate it. On my first flight with it, it slowly walked itself open during climbout and tried to kill me. Luckily the safety catch did its job. On the ground, I can sit in the plane with it latched and push up as hard as I want and the canopy won't budge. But, in an environment with vibration and buffeting, it can rotate itself open.

 

It depends on being over center and/or friction to stop it from rotating open. I don't think you should depend on a canopy being held closed by those things. I discovered that I am not the only one that has experienced this problem. It needs to have a real locking mechanism. I modified mine so it can't happen again.


Ron

 

On Tue, Jan 21, 2020 at 12:11 PM Nick U <unick3@...> wrote:

I found the rotary latch from www.eznoselift.com to be an easy install and works great.  I was able to close off the door, and now only have a small hole in the side of the plane for the key.  It works with the existing LGEZ hardware too.

 

 

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Nick Ugolini, www.nickugolini.com  

Charleston, SC 

 

LongEZ N29TM (for sale)

Cozy 4, N826ER

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 



On Jan 19, 2020, at 1:56 PM, Doug Kan <doug@...> wrote:

 

Anybody know of a good and hopefully inexpensive flush door handle for a LongEz. Maybe something like the Tesla door handle?

 


Marc J. Zeitlin
 

Ron Springer wrote:

I have the rotary latch and I both like it and hate it. On my first flight with it, it slowly walked itself open during climbout and tried to kill me. Luckily the safety catch did its job. On the ground, I can sit in the plane with it latched and push up as hard as I want and the canopy won't budge. But, in an environment with vibration and buffeting, it can rotate itself open.

It depends on being over center and/or friction to stop it from rotating open. I don't think you should depend on a canopy being held closed by those things. I discovered that I am not the only one that has experienced this problem. It needs to have a real locking mechanism. I modified mine so it can't happen again.

Agree completely. While I don't have the EZNOSELIFT latch on MY plane (and wouldn't), I've worked on a couple of customer's planes that have them and I feel the same as Ron, except for the "like it" part. I've had a customer have one walk itself open in flight, and as Ron says, it relies on friction and a theoretical over-center that's very difficult to achieve for safety. It also is ambiguous in usage and can be confusing to latch and use. It creates more problems than it solves. I don't recommend it.

And as Kevin Walsh says, as nice as the Hendricks latch is (and it is - I've worked on a few planes that have them, too), it's expensive, complicated, and difficult to install and get working. Why make things complicated?

--
Marc J. Zeitlin                      marc_zeitlin@...
                                            http://www.cozybuilders.org/
Copyright © 2020                     Burnside Aerospace


Kevin R. Walsh
 

I found the video of the Hendricks latchI made when I was installing it:


The over-center is absolutely required to make sure it is safe and does not unlatch.   


On Tue, Jan 21, 2020 at 10:06 AM Kevin R. Walsh <krwalsh@...> wrote:
I have that Hendricks latch, heavily modified, on my Cozy IV.  It is very pretty, flush from the outside, over-center on the inside, and works great.  I purchased a right hand latch, flipped it upside down, and then machined entirely new internals for it so the over-center works properly.  I even anodized it red, laser etched the LOCKED and OPEN arrow, so it looks very snazzy.

Take a look here, about halfway down: https://goo.gl/photos/LdNGQj6DSLbQvESy6

And I would never do it again.  It is a pain in the ass to get it right.  I think I made 3 or 4 of them before I was happy with it.  If anyone wants the CAD file, I think I have it somewhere on my old laptop.  If I were to do it again I would just do what Marc Zeitlin has on his plane, which is to say there is no external latch.  The internal latch gets stopped by the key lock, and the rest of the internals are plans or very close to plans.



On Tue, Jan 21, 2020 at 6:07 AM aviationeyes <skyeyecorp@...> wrote:
You mean like this one....?

Buy me one!
--Jose


On Sun, Jan 19, 2020, at 1:56 PM, Doug Kan wrote:
Anybody know of a good and hopefully inexpensive flush door handle for a LongEz. Maybe something like the Tesla door handle?

-- 
  




--
Kevin


--
Kevin


Greg Gullikson
 

Hi Mark,

I have the EZ Noselift latch also. I haven’t installed it on my Long-EZ build yet. Are you using the plans set up on your airplane or something different?

Thanks,
Greg Gullikson 


On Jan 21, 2020, at 11:10 AM, Marc J. Zeitlin <marc.j.zeitlin@...> wrote:


Ron Springer wrote:

I have the rotary latch and I both like it and hate it. On my first flight with it, it slowly walked itself open during climbout and tried to kill me. Luckily the safety catch did its job. On the ground, I can sit in the plane with it latched and push up as hard as I want and the canopy won't budge. But, in an environment with vibration and buffeting, it can rotate itself open.

It depends on being over center and/or friction to stop it from rotating open. I don't think you should depend on a canopy being held closed by those things. I discovered that I am not the only one that has experienced this problem. It needs to have a real locking mechanism. I modified mine so it can't happen again.

Agree completely. While I don't have the EZNOSELIFT latch on MY plane (and wouldn't), I've worked on a couple of customer's planes that have them and I feel the same as Ron, except for the "like it" part. I've had a customer have one walk itself open in flight, and as Ron says, it relies on friction and a theoretical over-center that's very difficult to achieve for safety. It also is ambiguous in usage and can be confusing to latch and use. It creates more problems than it solves. I don't recommend it.

And as Kevin Walsh says, as nice as the Hendricks latch is (and it is - I've worked on a few planes that have them, too), it's expensive, complicated, and difficult to install and get working. Why make things complicated?

--
Marc J. Zeitlin                      marc_zeitlin@...
                                            http://www.cozybuilders.org/
Copyright © 2020                     Burnside Aerospace


Don B
 

I have the rotary latch on my Longez and has not been a problem in 400 hrs of flying!


On Jan 21, 2020, at 10:48 AM, Ron Springer <ron228rj@...> wrote:


I have the rotary latch and I both like it and hate it. On my first flight with it, it slowly walked itself open during climbout and tried to kill me. Luckily the safety catch did its job. On the ground, I can sit in the plane with it latched and push up as hard as I want and the canopy won't budge. But, in an environment with vibration and buffeting, it can rotate itself open.

It depends on being over center and/or friction to stop it from rotating open. I don't think you should depend on a canopy being held closed by those things. I discovered that I am not the only one that has experienced this problem. It needs to have a real locking mechanism. I modified mine so it can't happen again.


Ron

On Tue, Jan 21, 2020 at 12:11 PM Nick U <unick3@...> wrote:
I found the rotary latch from www.eznoselift.com to be an easy install and works great.  I was able to close off the door, and now only have a small hole in the side of the plane for the key.  It works with the existing LGEZ hardware too.


---------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Nick Ugolini, www.nickugolini.com  
Charleston, SC 

LongEZ N29TM (for sale)
Cozy 4, N826ER











On Jan 19, 2020, at 1:56 PM, Doug Kan <doug@...> wrote:

Anybody know of a good and hopefully inexpensive flush door handle for a LongEz. Maybe something like the Tesla door handle?


Marc J. Zeitlin
 

Greg Gullikson wrote:
 
I have the EZ Noselift latch also. I haven’t installed it on my Long-EZ build yet.

Some folks have had good luck with it and have modified it to make it reliable.
 
Are you using the plans set up on your airplane or something different?

I have the stock latch on my plane, although if I were starting from scratch, I'd probably install the "shark latch" system. I like that a lot. I did get rid of the side fuselage door, though, as it leaked like a sieve in rain and leaked air when cold as well. I installed side windows instead, along with a small rotary lock, just above the window, that moves a lever in front of the latch mechanism so that if locked, it can't be opened from the outside. The canopy doesn't seal perfectly when locked from the outside since the latch itself isn't engaged, but with a cover, it's good enough to park outside in the rain. You can see the exterior lock circled in red, and I also dished out the longeron (and redid the fiberglass layups) under the canopy so that I could lift the canopy edge from the outside.

02_Pilot_Window.jpeg

In this inside view, you can see the rotary lock hidden behind the latch. When it's rotated into the "up" position, it prevents the latch arm from moving aft and keeps the canopy from being able to be raised.

04_Pilot_Window.jpeg

My solution - simple, lightweight, and easy. With a "shark latch", it would be perfect (enough) :-).

--
Marc J. Zeitlin                      marc_zeitlin@...
                                            http://www.cozybuilders.org/
Copyright © 2020                     Burnside Aerospace


Curtis Martin
 

Going with the kiss method,  
Picture the standard canopy latching system front most rod
Now clamp a split 3/4” block of aluminum around the rod about where the original door was
Find a standard rotating keyed lock similar to the type to lock a cabinet usually about 3/4” in dia.,long enough to penetrate the sidewall and reach close to the rod so that the little tab on the end of the lock set can reach the block clamped to the rod. Adjust the block so that the tab is against the block in the vertical and key locked  position and the latches on the canopy are holding the canopy but OBVIOUSLY not locked. We also imbedded a small tab on the canopy rail to assist in raising the canopy without trying to dig fat fingers in the small gap.
A couple of short comings are
 You cannot latch tightly against the canopy seal. (hasn’t been a problem for us while leaving the canopy naca vent open has! Lol)
Don’t loose the key with it locked! Hide a spare!
Sorry no pics for now but can around the end of Feb. if anyone wants.

A reminder, be sure the adjustment of your latching system won’t allow a wind blown canopy to latch and lock on its own
YMMV, I like the latest Bob Bitner latch, I am liking snow less and less, it’s cold in fla too, that is all.

 
Curtis Martin 
Retired Firefighter
Partner/builder of Long-ez N12LZ

On Jan 21, 2020, at 2:33 PM, Kevin R. Walsh <krwalsh@...> wrote:


I found the video of the Hendricks latchI made when I was installing it:


The over-center is absolutely required to make sure it is safe and does not unlatch.   

On Tue, Jan 21, 2020 at 10:06 AM Kevin R. Walsh <krwalsh@...> wrote:
I have that Hendricks latch, heavily modified, on my Cozy IV.  It is very pretty, flush from the outside, over-center on the inside, and works great.  I purchased a right hand latch, flipped it upside down, and then machined entirely new internals for it so the over-center works properly.  I even anodized it red, laser etched the LOCKED and OPEN arrow, so it looks very snazzy.

Take a look here, about halfway down: https://goo.gl/photos/LdNGQj6DSLbQvESy6

And I would never do it again.  It is a pain in the ass to get it right.  I think I made 3 or 4 of them before I was happy with it.  If anyone wants the CAD file, I think I have it somewhere on my old laptop.  If I were to do it again I would just do what Marc Zeitlin has on his plane, which is to say there is no external latch.  The internal latch gets stopped by the key lock, and the rest of the internals are plans or very close to plans.



On Tue, Jan 21, 2020 at 6:07 AM aviationeyes <skyeyecorp@...> wrote:
You mean like this one....?

Buy me one!
--Jose


On Sun, Jan 19, 2020, at 1:56 PM, Doug Kan wrote:
Anybody know of a good and hopefully inexpensive flush door handle for a LongEz. Maybe something like the Tesla door handle?

-- 
  




--
Kevin


--
Kevin


Mike Tooze
 





Ron makes some good points.

A Requirement is needed before designing anything.
For the Vari Eze /Long Eze canopy latch/lock system.
An example that is probably incomplete/can be improved:-

Latch
Secure canopy for flight - unaffected by in-flight vibration.
Operable with arm/hand strength of a teenage girl.
To be 'security locked' from outside without use of a 'door'.
Security lock will not 'over centre' the latch mechanism.
Security key lock to be flush with outside fuselage.
Latch to include a micro switch for the Eze warning system
Must be able to be opened by GIB.
Independent of safety catch.

Safety Catch
Independent from Latch.
Automatically engages when canopy is closed.
Can be reached/released by pilot and GIB

Attached photos of my solution sorry about their poor quality. I was leaning over for outside and hence all a bit shaky.
Note the photos were taken with the canopy open so actual latching is not shown - but works fine.

Mike Tooze O-235 VE G-EMMY

On Tuesday, 21 January 2020, 17:48:01 GMT, Ron Springer <ron228rj@...> wrote:


I have the rotary latch and I both like it and hate it. On my first flight with it, it slowly walked itself open during climbout and tried to kill me. Luckily the safety catch did its job. On the ground, I can sit in the plane with it latched and push up as hard as I want and the canopy won't budge. But, in an environment with vibration and buffeting, it can rotate itself open.

It depends on being over center and/or friction to stop it from rotating open. I don't think you should depend on a canopy being held closed by those things. I discovered that I am not the only one that has experienced this problem. It needs to have a real locking mechanism. I modified mine so it can't happen again.


Ron

On Tue, Jan 21, 2020 at 12:11 PM Nick U <unick3@...> wrote:
I found the rotary latch from www.eznoselift.com to be an easy install and works great.  I was able to close off the door, and now only have a small hole in the side of the plane for the key.  It works with the existing LGEZ hardware too.


---------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Nick Ugolini, www.nickugolini.com  
Charleston, SC 

LongEZ N29TM (for sale)
Cozy 4, N826ER











On Jan 19, 2020, at 1:56 PM, Doug Kan <doug@...> wrote:

Anybody know of a good and hopefully inexpensive flush door handle for a LongEz. Maybe something like the Tesla door handle?


skorija
 

Over time the bolts through the longeron become loose. I reinforced mine with pc7 on outside and pc7 and aluminum plates on inside. 

Pc7 is a very tough epoxy. I’ve seen it last 45 years outside. 

Mike aka dust


On Jan 23, 2020, at 9:27 AM, Mike Tooze via Groups.Io <miketooze@...> wrote:






Ron makes some good points.

A Requirement is needed before designing anything.
For the Vari Eze /Long Eze canopy latch/lock system.
An example that is probably incomplete/can be improved:-

Latch
Secure canopy for flight - unaffected by in-flight vibration.
Operable with arm/hand strength of a teenage girl.
To be 'security locked' from outside without use of a 'door'.
Security lock will not 'over centre' the latch mechanism.
Security key lock to be flush with outside fuselage.
Latch to include a micro switch for the Eze warning system
Must be able to be opened by GIB.
Independent of safety catch.

Safety Catch
Independent from Latch.
Automatically engages when canopy is closed.
Can be reached/released by pilot and GIB

Attached photos of my solution sorry about their poor quality. I was leaning over for outside and hence all a bit shaky.
Note the photos were taken with the canopy open so actual latching is not shown - but works fine.

Mike Tooze O-235 VE G-EMMY

On Tuesday, 21 January 2020, 17:48:01 GMT, Ron Springer <ron228rj@...> wrote:


I have the rotary latch and I both like it and hate it. On my first flight with it, it slowly walked itself open during climbout and tried to kill me. Luckily the safety catch did its job. On the ground, I can sit in the plane with it latched and push up as hard as I want and the canopy won't budge. But, in an environment with vibration and buffeting, it can rotate itself open.

It depends on being over center and/or friction to stop it from rotating open. I don't think you should depend on a canopy being held closed by those things. I discovered that I am not the only one that has experienced this problem. It needs to have a real locking mechanism. I modified mine so it can't happen again.


Ron

On Tue, Jan 21, 2020 at 12:11 PM Nick U <unick3@...> wrote:
I found the rotary latch from www.eznoselift.com to be an easy install and works great.  I was able to close off the door, and now only have a small hole in the side of the plane for the key.  It works with the existing LGEZ hardware too.


---------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Nick Ugolini, www.nickugolini.com  
Charleston, SC 

LongEZ N29TM (for sale)
Cozy 4, N826ER











On Jan 19, 2020, at 1:56 PM, Doug Kan <doug@...> wrote:

Anybody know of a good and hopefully inexpensive flush door handle for a LongEz. Maybe something like the Tesla door handle?

Attachments:


Mike Tooze
 

Hi Mike,

My handle pivot runs in a plain bearing floxed into the longeron. See first photo.
It is (unnecessarily) accessed via the hole just visible top left in the, last, outside fuselage shot.

The latch is pivoted on a spacer which is bearing/locked onto a washer so that its bolt is both floxed and hard bolted into the longeron.

No slack bolts/pivots.
No problems in our thirty eight year ;^)

Mike T

On Thursday, 23 January 2020, 14:51:17 GMT, skorija via Groups.Io <skorija@...> wrote:


Over time the bolts through the longeron become loose. I reinforced mine with pc7 on outside and pc7 and aluminum plates on inside. 

Pc7 is a very tough epoxy. I’ve seen it last 45 years outside. 

Mike aka dust


On Jan 23, 2020, at 9:27 AM, Mike Tooze via Groups.Io <miketooze@...> wrote:






Ron makes some good points.

A Requirement is needed before designing anything.
For the Vari Eze /Long Eze canopy latch/lock system.
An example that is probably incomplete/can be improved:-

Latch
Secure canopy for flight - unaffected by in-flight vibration.
Operable with arm/hand strength of a teenage girl.
To be 'security locked' from outside without use of a 'door'.
Security lock will not 'over centre' the latch mechanism.
Security key lock to be flush with outside fuselage.
Latch to include a micro switch for the Eze warning system
Must be able to be opened by GIB.
Independent of safety catch.

Safety Catch
Independent from Latch.
Automatically engages when canopy is closed.
Can be reached/released by pilot and GIB

Attached photos of my solution sorry about their poor quality. I was leaning over for outside and hence all a bit shaky.
Note the photos were taken with the canopy open so actual latching is not shown - but works fine.

Mike Tooze O-235 VE G-EMMY

On Tuesday, 21 January 2020, 17:48:01 GMT, Ron Springer <ron228rj@...> wrote:


I have the rotary latch and I both like it and hate it. On my first flight with it, it slowly walked itself open during climbout and tried to kill me. Luckily the safety catch did its job. On the ground, I can sit in the plane with it latched and push up as hard as I want and the canopy won't budge. But, in an environment with vibration and buffeting, it can rotate itself open.

It depends on being over center and/or friction to stop it from rotating open. I don't think you should depend on a canopy being held closed by those things. I discovered that I am not the only one that has experienced this problem. It needs to have a real locking mechanism. I modified mine so it can't happen again.


Ron

On Tue, Jan 21, 2020 at 12:11 PM Nick U <unick3@...> wrote:
I found the rotary latch from www.eznoselift.com to be an easy install and works great.  I was able to close off the door, and now only have a small hole in the side of the plane for the key.  It works with the existing LGEZ hardware too.


---------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Nick Ugolini, www.nickugolini.com  
Charleston, SC 

LongEZ N29TM (for sale)
Cozy 4, N826ER











On Jan 19, 2020, at 1:56 PM, Doug Kan <doug@...> wrote:

Anybody know of a good and hopefully inexpensive flush door handle for a LongEz. Maybe something like the Tesla door handle?

Attachments:


aviationeyes
 

Good set of design specs. I would add one more...To be easily understood by an un-initiated observer from the outside needing to open your canopy in an emergency. To me, that was the initial promise of the Hendricks lock.
--Jose


On Thu, Jan 23, 2020, at 9:27 AM, Mike Tooze via Groups.Io wrote:
Ron makes some good points.

A Requirement is needed before designing anything.
For the Vari Eze /Long Eze canopy latch/lock system.
An example that is probably incomplete/can be improved:-

Latch
Secure canopy for flight - unaffected by in-flight vibration.
Operable with arm/hand strength of a teenage girl.
To be 'security locked' from outside without use of a 'door'.
Security lock will not 'over centre' the latch mechanism.
Security key lock to be flush with outside fuselage.
Latch to include a micro switch for the Eze warning system
Must be able to be opened by GIB.
Independent of safety catch.

Safety Catch
Independent from Latch.
Automatically engages when canopy is closed.
Can be reached/released by pilot and GIB
...


aviationeyes
 

I have observed that to be true with one of my bolts. Even loose, however, security is still effective. If it gets much worse, I may try out the Pc7.
--Jose


On Thu, Jan 23, 2020, at 9:51 AM, skorija via Groups.Io wrote:
Over time the bolts through the longeron become loose. I reinforced mine with pc7 on outside and pc7 and aluminum plates on inside. 

Pc7 is a very tough epoxy. I’ve seen it last 45 years outside. 

Mike aka dust




Dale Martin
 

>>> Latch to include a micro switch for the Eze warning system<<<

One thing I change on most aircraft with the complaint that the warning horn is intermittent.

The plans system attaches the micro-switch to the handle such that I have witnessed to LEZ pilots start the take-off roll and abort because the canopy started lifting up.
It was due to the latch being secured but the latch was not engaged.  What the pilot needs to know is if that the canopy handle pawl has fully engage the canopy pins (screws) and is fully down when the canopy handle is locked in the latch.  And if so THEN and ONLY THEN, should the micro-switch indicate the canopy is SAFE.

On clients aircraft we install The Shark Tooth Latching part only to the stock canopy handle and mount the micro-switch under the longeron and use a proximity pin that is forced downward by the canopy.  The canopy can only close this tight when the handle and pawls are engaged.  


Yes, we have pictures for those interested.


Dale
For Contact info - See Website
http://www.long-ez.com
=====================>


On Thu, Jan 23, 2020 at 6:27 AM Mike Tooze via Groups.Io <miketooze=btinternet.com@groups.io> wrote:




Ron makes some good points.

A Requirement is needed before designing anything.
For the Vari Eze /Long Eze canopy latch/lock system.
An example that is probably incomplete/can be improved:-

Latch
Secure canopy for flight - unaffected by in-flight vibration.
Operable with arm/hand strength of a teenage girl.
To be 'security locked' from outside without use of a 'door'.
Security lock will not 'over centre' the latch mechanism.
Security key lock to be flush with outside fuselage.
Latch to include a micro switch for the Eze warning system
Must be able to be opened by GIB.
Independent of safety catch.

Safety Catch
Independent from Latch.
Automatically engages when canopy is closed.
Can be reached/released by pilot and GIB

Attached photos of my solution sorry about their poor quality. I was leaning over for outside and hence all a bit shaky.
Note the photos were taken with the canopy open so actual latching is not shown - but works fine.

Mike Tooze O-235 VE G-EMMY

On Tuesday, 21 January 2020, 17:48:01 GMT, Ron Springer <ron228rj@...> wrote:


I have the rotary latch and I both like it and hate it. On my first flight with it, it slowly walked itself open during climbout and tried to kill me. Luckily the safety catch did its job. On the ground, I can sit in the plane with it latched and push up as hard as I want and the canopy won't budge. But, in an environment with vibration and buffeting, it can rotate itself open.

It depends on being over center and/or friction to stop it from rotating open. I don't think you should depend on a canopy being held closed by those things. I discovered that I am not the only one that has experienced this problem. It needs to have a real locking mechanism. I modified mine so it can't happen again.


Ron

On Tue, Jan 21, 2020 at 12:11 PM Nick U <unick3@...> wrote:
I found the rotary latch from www.eznoselift.com to be an easy install and works great.  I was able to close off the door, and now only have a small hole in the side of the plane for the key.  It works with the existing LGEZ hardware too.


---------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Nick Ugolini, www.nickugolini.com  
Charleston, SC 

LongEZ N29TM (for sale)
Cozy 4, N826ER











On Jan 19, 2020, at 1:56 PM, Doug Kan <doug@...> wrote:

Anybody know of a good and hopefully inexpensive flush door handle for a LongEz. Maybe something like the Tesla door handle?

Attachments:


Mike Tooze
 

With my arrangement the cam shape on the latch requires more energy, a hard push on the handle, to release the latch (which additionally had to be pulled back to release.).
The cam (and spring) tends to hold the latch 'home' and further towards the micro switch. i.e. further to the locked state. But in practice the micro switch is only made when the latch is fully home against the spigot of the handle.
When closing my canopy I don't rely on the spring. I operate the handle (left hand) and snug up the latch with my right thumb.
When locked it would require a mechanical failure or the laws of quantum mechanics invoked to release the canopy without pilot involvement.;^)

Mike T

On Friday, 24 January 2020, 02:20:27 GMT, Dale Martin <niceez@...> wrote:


>>>Latch to include a micro switch for the Eze warning system<<<

One thing I change on most aircraft with the complaint that the warning horn is intermittent.

The plans system attaches the micro-switch to the handle such that I have witnessed to LEZ pilots start the take-off roll and abort because the canopy started lifting up.
It was due to the latch being secured but the latch was not engaged.  What the pilot needs to know is if that the canopy handle pawl has fully engage the canopy pins (screws) and is fully down when the canopy handle is locked in the latch.  And if so THEN and ONLY THEN, should the micro-switch indicate the canopy is SAFE.

On clients aircraft we install The Shark Tooth Latching part only to the stock canopy handle and mount the micro-switch under the longeron and use a proximity pin that is forced downward by the canopy.  The canopy can only close this tight when the handle and pawls are engaged.  


Yes, we have pictures for those interested.


Dale
For Contact info - See Website
http://www.long-ez.com
=====================>


On Thu, Jan 23, 2020 at 6:27 AM Mike Tooze via Groups.Io <miketooze=btinternet.com@groups.io> wrote:




Ron makes some good points.

A Requirement is needed before designing anything.
For the Vari Eze /Long Eze canopy latch/lock system.
An example that is probably incomplete/can be improved:-

Latch
Secure canopy for flight - unaffected by in-flight vibration.
Operable with arm/hand strength of a teenage girl.
To be 'security locked' from outside without use of a 'door'.
Security lock will not 'over centre' the latch mechanism.
Security key lock to be flush with outside fuselage.
Latch to include a micro switch for the Eze warning system
Must be able to be opened by GIB.
Independent of safety catch.

Safety Catch
Independent from Latch.
Automatically engages when canopy is closed.
Can be reached/released by pilot and GIB

Attached photos of my solution sorry about their poor quality. I was leaning over for outside and hence all a bit shaky.
Note the photos were taken with the canopy open so actual latching is not shown - but works fine.

Mike Tooze O-235 VE G-EMMY

On Tuesday, 21 January 2020, 17:48:01 GMT, Ron Springer <ron228rj@...> wrote:


I have the rotary latch and I both like it and hate it. On my first flight with it, it slowly walked itself open during climbout and tried to kill me. Luckily the safety catch did its job. On the ground, I can sit in the plane with it latched and push up as hard as I want and the canopy won't budge. But, in an environment with vibration and buffeting, it can rotate itself open.

It depends on being over center and/or friction to stop it from rotating open. I don't think you should depend on a canopy being held closed by those things. I discovered that I am not the only one that has experienced this problem. It needs to have a real locking mechanism. I modified mine so it can't happen again.


Ron

On Tue, Jan 21, 2020 at 12:11 PM Nick U <unick3@...> wrote:
I found the rotary latch from www.eznoselift.com to be an easy install and works great.  I was able to close off the door, and now only have a small hole in the side of the plane for the key.  It works with the existing LGEZ hardware too.


---------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Nick Ugolini, www.nickugolini.com  
Charleston, SC 

LongEZ N29TM (for sale)
Cozy 4, N826ER











On Jan 19, 2020, at 1:56 PM, Doug Kan <doug@...> wrote:

Anybody know of a good and hopefully inexpensive flush door handle for a LongEz. Maybe something like the Tesla door handle?

Attachments:


Mike Tooze
 

'Canopy release from outside.'
By all means you could add that to your Requirements list.

At the time I did consider adding it.
With my arrangement it just means running a second cable in parallel with the GIB release cable outside with a pull ring and annotation (including indication how to release the safety catch.).
But I decided not to bother with that.

I just have the standard canopy hinge-pin pull loops on the basis that if things got that bad wrecking the canopy would be no big deal.

Mike T.


On Thursday, 23 January 2020, 16:06:26 GMT, aviationeyes <skyeyecorp@...> wrote:


Good set of design specs. I would add one more...To be easily understood by an un-initiated observer from the outside needing to open your canopy in an emergency. To me, that was the initial promise of the Hendricks lock.
--Jose


On Thu, Jan 23, 2020, at 9:27 AM, Mike Tooze via Groups.Io wrote:
Ron makes some good points.

A Requirement is needed before designing anything.
For the Vari Eze /Long Eze canopy latch/lock system.
An example that is probably incomplete/can be improved:-

Latch
Secure canopy for flight - unaffected by in-flight vibration.
Operable with arm/hand strength of a teenage girl.
To be 'security locked' from outside without use of a 'door'.
Security lock will not 'over centre' the latch mechanism.
Security key lock to be flush with outside fuselage.
Latch to include a micro switch for the Eze warning system
Must be able to be opened by GIB.
Independent of safety catch.

Safety Catch
Independent from Latch.
Automatically engages when canopy is closed.
Can be reached/released by pilot and GIB
...